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Well as it happens yes we did ask them to do a redesign of European Webmasters and yes, as of right now they havent been paid because the work hasnt been finished.
Andrew is still waiting on a list of changes from us which unfortunately, has had to take a back seat due to a bunch of stuff including 4 weeks or hurricanes and preparations for Vegas.
Once we send Andrew the changes and the work is completed to a satisfactory level the guy will be paid.
It is unfortunate that it had to come to this however, as a company we are sure that many of you would have taken the same action had any of your as yet, un-released work were made public knowledge.
It is unfortunate that it had to come to this however, as a company we are sure that many of you would have taken the same action had any of your as yet, un-released work were made public knowledge.
I just went and looked
Lee, there was a reason I posted this over here rather than over there
Is Uchase/webpry part of bluedesign ? If he isn't, then really the issue should be between bluedesign and him. He posted the shit. Did he do it on bluedesign's behalf or just because he wanted to start drama ?
Hmm..It's no concern of yours for sure. But, I wonder if bluedesigns knows that uchase is pulling this shit.
This could be a case of a designer getting another persons opinion on something and that someone deciding to get a little drama value of it and fucking the deal up.
The idea of someone showing the design to someone else isn't at all improper. We all need other opinions at times and the client is not always available at the moment we need it. When I am working on a project, if I don't have an NDA involved, I sometimes show it to several key people that I value the opinion of while I am working on it. If I have to put it up on the web to show them, I password protect it and kill the user/password after I get my feedback.
That the new design was publically posted. And payment is being demanded by someone who is not involved with the project (apparently) is what is fucked up.
I would love to hear what Andrew has to say on it.
Originally posted by sarettah@Oct 12 2004, 09:01 PM I see that bluedesigns finally showed up. Now we need to see if he knew the dweeb was doing this or not.
If I was Andrew I would be kicking me some uchase ass in public right about now.
..and if I was Lee,
I wouldn't pay shit to nobody just as a matter of principle
;-)))
Originally posted by Serge_Oprano@Oct 12 2004, 09:09 PM Lee,
convert into Judaism and repeat after me the FIRST Jewish comandment:
"Though shall not pay"
;-))))
Originally posted by Serge_Oprano@Oct 12 2004, 06:09 PM Lee,
convert into Judaism and repeat after me the FIRST Jewish comandment:
"Though shall not pay"
;-))))
LOL
You know if it were any other company, we woul dhave taken that stance but Gary, Chris and I decided it was better to be out $550 and one design than to have our somewhat impecible (cough) reputations sullied.
As it stands, right now, [i think] we turned out to be the good guys throughout this.
Well, I was kind of hoping you would turn out to be the good guys. That's why I posted this originally.
But, Serge has a point there. If Bluedesigns told uchase it was ok to do that shit, I wouldn't part with a dime. If it turns out that he was not aware of it, then it's time to take it all back behind the scenes and see what could be worked out.
Since Andrew isn't telling the guy to shut up, it looks like he might have given the go ahead. Stupid way to do biz, imho.
Originally posted by sarettah@Oct 12 2004, 06:19 PM Well, I was kind of hoping you would turn out to be the good guys. That's why I posted this originally.
But, Serge has a point there. If Bluedesigns told uchase it was ok to do that shit, I wouldn't part with a dime. If it turns out that he was not aware of it, then it's time to take it all back behind the scenes and see what could be worked out.
Since Andrew isn't telling the guy to shut up, it looks like he might have given the go ahead. Stupid way to do biz, imho.
You know to be honest, in the long run its going to be easier for us to just pay the dude his $500 for the uncompleted design.
Im the first to admit we have had some communication problems along the way some of which were on our end, some on his end of things but thats neither here nor there.
First and foremost what matters is the issue gets resolved and well, if that means we have to pay for a design we arent happy with.. in order to protect our company name, thats what we will do.
Originally posted by XXXPhoto@Oct 12 2004, 07:41 PM Hell Lee, I'll be so secretive even you can't see it... plus I'm done already! How's that for service? LMK where to send the invoice... lol
Originally posted by Lee@Oct 12 2004, 09:37 PM We had thought about that but in all honesty, getting someone to 'clean' up a design that everyone has already seen is pointless.
The 'new' design we had planned has / will now have lost its impact.
We'll just go to a designer we know isnt going to show our work to anyone and plan a new concept.
You don't honestly believe that do you?
I still haven't seen the designs and I'm trying to follow the thread.
Do you think all adult wbmasters read GFY? Chances are, it won't matter
__________________ Sharky Pimp Mansion :: Marketing and Program Director
icq: 1242876
Originally posted by sharky@Oct 12 2004, 08:03 PM Chances are, it won't matter
Chances are Mike you are correct but, im not in the business of taking chances as im sure you arent either.
Plus, lets be honest about this, this BDS stuff *IS* going to haunt this design whether we get someone to clean it up or not. I would rather start afresh with someone else.
I'm shocked at how dishonest Lee is. I've done business with Lee in the past and I never expected this of him.
Allow me to set a few things straight:
Quote:
"Its unfortunate that it had to come to this, as it stands right now, because of their unprofessionalism we are out $500. I beleive the saying goes 'live and learn'. "
I fail to see how you are out of $500? I'm out of more than $550 since February 2003, when we designed your european webmaster site.
Quote:
"Just a shame it had to go to the boards when a simple email would have sufficed.. ah well"
Lee, WHAT THE FUCK ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT HERE?
I've been emailing you at least monthly and most months at least weekly, and you have not responded to a single email in 6 MONTHS.
I've sent you countless ICQ msgs, none of which you have replied to, for over 6 MONTHS. (Am I on your ignore list or invisable list? Do you think this is a reputable way to do business?)
Shit I've even posted in all your threads on GFY asking you to contact me asap.
I have taken every single measure possible to have you contact me Lee.
We've had clients fuck us over in the past - usually, when a client stops responding to emails and all other methods of communication for 6 months, this is a pretty good indication that you've been fucked over. Especially when they haven't paid.
You claim there was a 'final change' that you wanted on that site.. that's BS, you know it as well as I do.
Don't you think it would have been easier to let me know this 'final change' in Feb/March 03, and then you would have the site done, and could have paid up, would that not have been easier?
__________________
Contact GonZo for a banner in your signature.
As it stands, right now, [i think] we turned out to be the good guys throughout this.
You are joking, right?
I haven't seen a single person supporting you out of the many who have posted on the multiple threads on this topic.
We have received nothing but praise and support.
How can you be in the right when you ignore ICQ/Email/Msg board contact for over 6 months, on a job we started 9 months ago?
You said you were prioritizing and didn't have any time to respond to me? How much longer should I have waited for a response? 10 months? 1 year? 2 years?
You had lots of time to make 1000's of useless posts, but didn't have 1 minute in the last 6 months to respond to an email?
Quote:
We'll just go to a designer we know isnt going to show our work to anyone and plan a new concept.
I can't imagine any designers who would want to work with you after this, they'd have to be either very stupid, very desperate, or both.
Quote:
Plus, lets be honest about this, this BDS stuff *IS* going to haunt this design whether we get someone to clean it up or not. I would rather start afresh with someone else.
It will not haunt the design, but it will haunt you. Your shady business practises have been exposed.
Lee - there is no excuse for the way you've conducted yourself. The least you can do is pay up as you promised, to retain what little if any reputation you may have.
I'm not one to hold grudges, but the sooner we can clear this up and move on the better.
__________________
Contact GonZo for a banner in your signature.
Originally posted by Serge_Oprano@Oct 13 2004, 12:09 PM Lee,
convert into Judaism and repeat after me the FIRST Jewish comandment:
"Though shall not pay"
;-))))
I have no affiliation with Lee. I've posted on his Gay board and that's it.
I have worked with Andrew at Blue Design Studios this last month and I must say I feel ripped off and taken advantage of.
I've been in the adult online business over 5 years now and have seen Blue Design Studios past work and expected the same level of quality for the work I commissioned from them.
I paid $350 ( in advance ) for 5 banner designs ( 2 sizes each design ) for a total of 10 banners.
I'm currently in Australia and tried calling Andrew at Blue Design Studios and their number was disconnected ( it has since been taken off their contact page ). I wanted to tell him what I had in mind for my banner designs and the concept for a new niche site I'm launching next month. After I emailed him he declined to give me their new number to talk voice and convey the design concept I wanted so I sent Andrew the banners I liked. I expected the same quality that I saw on their website portfolio and that all of us have come to expect from Blue Design Studios and their competitors. I made a page for you guys to see the banners I sent them, and the designs I got in return. Here is what I got from BlueDesignStudios
I ended up re-designing one banner myself and you can see it at the bottom of the page. I've only had time so far to redo their work on one banner. For me graphic work is time consuming, as graphic design isn't my strong point, that's why I hired out Blue Design Studios to do the work. As you can see my own redesign is sleeker and of much better quality then what I paid $350 for.
When Andrew emailed me back after the design was complete I told him that the text and quality wasn't what I had in mind, but that I did like the graphical cumshot I requested. I sent him the banner I redesigned as an example and said I didn't have time to re-design the work he'd done... I've yet to hear back from him. This was a few weeks ago. Either he's too busy, or feels his work is worth $350. I disagree.
I normally wouldn't make a post like this but I had to speak out about my experience... especially when I see Blue Design Studios is having difficulty with other clients and permitting the kinds of degrading posts I've seen on GFY posted on behalf of Blue Design Studios.
Either Blue Design Studios has lost their best graphic designer or they only give quality work to those whom they consider to be "high profile" clients. Either way I ended up with work I could have done better myself.
Again I'm not on anyone’s side here.. this is MY personal experience with Blue Design Studios. They obviously aren't interested in correcting their work and I doubt they'll refund my money.
Same experience as Squirt with Andrew and Blue Design.. spent $1500 for a tour and some banners 12 months ago. A proper designer did a layout for approval and it came back really fast.
As soon as Andrew had the money he didn't answer another ICQ. Much later than promised, my partner shows me a site he was delivered which I thought had to be another draft for approval.. and a rough one! But someone with no idea and no care for their work had taken the original slick 1 page layout and butchered it into a multi page tour without adding a single extra graphic element as I can recall.. and that was delivered as final for a $1500 tour!
I'd post the site in question but my partner at that time is actually using it now and I dont think he would appreciate it.
I'm not sure why we didn't demand our money back at the time come to think of it.. it was just insulting what they gave us I thought.. and it seemed obvious trying to getting satisfaction from these guys would be time consuming and probably a waste.
After seeing the posts the Bluedesign guy has been making around here the last few days over 500 bucks.. we were right thinking that these guys were nothing but trouble, and it was a good decision to write it off and move on I think.
We said to each other back then we would make a point of warning associates off and leave it at that... but I had forgotten about warning people before now!
I've been talking to Andrew at Blue Design Studios on ICQ and it seems we've missed emails. Andrew says he always want's the customer to be happy and I'm sure that will be the outcome. I could have chased up the unanswered email but I've been extremely busy shooting content for my new site etc and put it on the back burner.
We did some work for Lee, he asked for many changes, all of which we did, he then insisted there were more changes, but he refused to send them by ignoring us.
We requested via email, icq and gfy countless times for over 6 months, he ignored all these requests to contact us.
Another client of ours has a disliking for Lee, he wanted to know why we were continually bumping Lee's posts on GFY with "please contact us Lee", when he found out he took matters into his own hands.
Lee admitted on GFY he had been too busy to respond or to organise the final feedback and this was his fault.
He also said he would pay his bill, then a couple of days later he changed his mind and said he would not pay.
For the record, we did not bring this to the boards, nor did we design that europeanlee.com site.
Bottom line he owes us money and refuses to pay.
He can cry all he likes, but he admitted on GFY he was in the wrong, and said he would pay, then went back on his word.
for fucking $500 , all this fucking drama!!!!!!!!!!
Shit combine all posts on each board and surely its better for all concerned to wipe their mouths ( you are all fortunate enough to have now learned a new pikey expression ) and do something constructive...I mean it must be a days labour just to type and read the bullshit....fuck...go and do something constructive and you might all earn $500 for the day anyway...
"... hey lee, grab that sextoyfag and come back to gfy, I had so much fun with you guys. "
You know, some would say calling a guy a fag would be like calling you a nigger. Neither one is acceptable.. unless of course the guys real posting name was "sextoyfag"
10-12-2004
h34r:
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