Oprano Webmaster Forum

Mike AI: Having discussed the matter with him and hearing the surrounding circumstances, I gave him no quarter as far as holding him responsible for what is happening and he agrees that he responsible for a gross error in judgement. In his case, he relied on his employers. They set up the shoot and hired him for the job. He did not solicit or produce any of it yet he is the one going down for it. But the point is, he should've checked the id and not trusted the employers to make the right decision for him.

He is a nice guy but he made the biggest mistake anyone could make. I am not about to grind him on it. He is doing the time and that will be plenty sufficient.

I would rather support his effort to be a warning to all of us since none of us are truly immune to the same issue, fake identification. Does that make sense?

I suppose I could be evil Far-l about it, but I am on the meds and feeling quite equinanimous and forgiving these days. Can you tell?

Far-L Far-L returns in PIG FUCKERS IN PARADISE

Yep,

Far-L calls the kiddy fucker a kind and gentle soul over on the other board. Looks like he does mind kiddy porners that much after all.

Monk

Snoops,

congrats on the merger with maxcash:)
sextoyking Promote glass sextoys and make $$$

Mike and mutt,
At last!This is EXACTLY what I have never got!

I am vilified for spamming.

But I see people making scat videos,convicted pimps,and others,fated and applauded and considered "good guys"....

Should have gone to more conventions,hooked up more webmasters with naked chicks and booze,I guess...

funny business isn't it ;))

Nick

Michael, at least there's karma: from what I've heard (and please, understand that I've never been in a men's correctional facility - no matter WHAT Shok has told you!), child molesters, regardless of how old they "thought" the child was, are treated with a special flair in jail ;)

Peaches

Climbing out of my sick bed ....

You got to be fucking kidding me
Too much to do to rant now but .....
I hope that stupid son of a bitch get sodomized by Bubba and his girlfriends

p.s. If anyone around you contracts a stomach virus hire professional help to come in and take care of them

Vick Well guess who's back in circulation ........

wow ..what a moron.

hey where's that webmaster who beat the kind old bicycle shop owner into a bloody pulp and left him to die? He should check out Amateur Masters maybe they need some help.
mutt

Mike,

read that news story and posts on that amateur board, fuck everyone is being so friendly...
sextoyking

mutt,
It seems it is not just me that has the morals I can afford. ;)

*Note 1) these morals are flexible and will be redefined now and again dependent in part on my finacial situation ;))
Nick

Mike - I got your congrats hon - but I haven't really read any boards but two since I got back - been absolutely buried :(

Thanx for the congrats - much appreciated. Hopefully now that I'm *almost* caught up I can take time to read Oprano like I was doing.

Looks like some interesting discussion today for sure LOL

:o)
Snoops (Ð)

Yeah funny isn't it Mutt?

here is his post on the matter:

________________________________

TJay,

This totally sucks and confirms that our legal system has failed us. That's total bullshit!!!

I wish you nothing but support for the next year, and hope that the year passes by as fast as possible. I've really enjoyed your great comments and knowledgable feedback, and can't wait to pick your brain when you return. We'll miss you a lot, and hope you get back as quickly as possible!!

Best of luck my friend.

______________________________

HAHAHA how freaking ironic is this. no pop-up windows, but fucking 14 year old girls on the internet is cool, and sendint this ass clown to jail is a grave injustice!

Mike AI

really? RickYNOT is comforting the pimp and kiddy porner? Isn't this the guy whose moral compass told him that it was very wrong for webmasters to trick porn surfers into clicking on blind links? And he's got no problem with a pimp and a kiddy diddler on his board?

mutt

Snoops, Serge and I already congradulated you guys and were upset over the fact no one made an annoucement here!

So good luck to all you guys!

Mike AI

Just like my arguments on beastiality, just because
I make conterpoints does not mean I participate
in any of the mentioned activities, or condon it or
think it right or wrong.

Shit....i've already been gone over with a fine tooth
comb and I break no laws and have no involvement in
any promotion of any "questionable" material.

My partners are fine Nick...... they are completely
isolated from my situation.

CAM

Snoop .. Congrats! :)

Colin TGP2.COM

Poop - would you guys remove one of those? First post gave a tcp/ip error so I thought it hadn't posted

<sigh>

Long day LOL

Snoops (Ð)

I am content to live by the rules.
_______________

far l, I think this is very noble of you. However on Amateur Masters you seem to be coddling TJay, a convited felon, someone who is not only a statuetory rapist, but also someone who deals in KP online.

Did I miss read what you wrote? OR do you think this guy shuold be set free?

Mike AI

I've been going back over where all this announcement was made and found a few boards that were miseed :o(

So, here is the official announcement :o)

MaxCash & WebOverdrive are very pleased to announce that they are joining forces. The combining of the strengths and services they each have provided to the adult webmaster community for years is sure to benefit adult webmasters - both new and veteran. Each company has built their reputation on integrity, honesty & providing the information necessary to today's webmaster in order to help him or her succeed and increase their bottom line. RB, Aly, Snoops & Tweet each feel this alliance will do nothing but enhance their contributions to the webmaster community - making it, and them, stronger as a whole.

RB, Aly, Snoops & Tweet

Sorry 'bout that - been busier than a cat in a room full of rocking chairs since getting back from Mardi Gras (which, btw, was a BLAST!)

Hellos to Mike and Serge :o)
Snoops (Ð)

Cam: You are making some reasonable points and playing the devils advocate role nicely.

Sure, the age limit might be arbitrary, and historically perspectives change periodically. Remember the good old days when kids were sent down at age 6 into the coal mines?

The main point I see is regardless of where you draw the line of morality about what is or is not an age of consent, or cross over the gap of double standards, or attempt any rational discourse of this matter, the fact remains that THE LAW in this country says that 18 and over is ok, but under that is not ok. Period.

Those softcore lolita sites apall many of us, but for now at least they are operating legally.

We are all free to make our own judgements about whether that is appropriate or not.

We are all free to expose or shield our children from such contemptuous commerciality based on these amoral agendas.

So what if our society has fixed these standards that all of us must live by? At least we still live in a country where pornography is not a crime punishable by death like Singapore.

It is close enough to a free country that I am not complaining.

I am content to live by the rules.

As a parent, I send my kids to a school where watching tv is completely discouraged. I think kids will experience more "porn and obscenity" just walking through the check out stand in the grocery store than they will ever be influenced by something we or any or our peers produces. I am concerned about that and I take responsibility as a parent to protect against detrimental media coercion.

Debating the point is fine, but only comes down to some esoteric intellectual arguments.

As a parent, I only have so much time for that stuff before I have to go and get a band aid or read or story or any of the things parents do for their kids.

Far-L Far-L returns in PIG FUCKERS IN PARADISE

The only medal I would give him is a gold medal in
stupidity!
CAM

I have no friends in the internet world but my
2 partners....

Now you pulled them into the frame. ;)))

Peaches,
---Have you ever talked to a teenage girl?! Running a website isn't exactly on their minds - they're more worried if Jim likes Sue or Fran and which eyeshadow makes their eyes look better.
********************************

Thats pushing it,imho.

Maturity is reached at differing times (shit,I can give you some good arguments that I am not there yet;) and an age is set by law.

IMHO I think as a result of society maturity is reached a lot earlier than say 30 yrs ago....but I digress
Nick

What is even funnier is that all the amateurs including RickYNOT are kissing his ass and being nice to him.

http://chat.amateurmasters.com/public/ChatView.cgi?T=295

What kind of INDSUTRY do we work in??

This guy should be condemned by EVERYONE PERIOD! The she looked liked 20 ( at 14? my ass!) is BULLSHIT!

Mike AI

Is this guy a moron?

Jenna:

I am selling the domain name hollywoodsexcams.com

and I was wondering if you would like to buy it? The name would draw alot of Europeans

to the site because they are very interested in Hollywood, CA.

The asking price for the name is 2 million dollars in cash, plus I wish to receive a percent of

the profit the site makes. I am asking for 2% of the site revenue. I also think that Howard

Stern would love the site.

Robert

I asked him if he was on crack, he says, he doesn't do drugs and for me to check greaddomains.com to see what great domains sell for
I told him he couldn't sell his domain for $900
Meni (The Golden Tongue)

I would say that case of Mary Kay LeTourneau is a bad example,
well maybe a good example for the legal argument??

That kid was having the time of his life fucking his hot teacher..
that is until something happended?

I truly do not believe that any molesting of that boy took
place......he has sex with her of his own will... she had his
fucking kid for christs sake!

anyway....the law was applied.... and I don't agree with
it at all.

I would have given my left nut to have a affair with a few
of my teachers at 13.

CAM

This is very topical, and kind of amusing in a sick way.

http://www.toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?Date=20020226&Category=NEWS02&ArtNo=102260006&Ref=AR

This is one of the guys, Tjay at AmateurMasters who was jumping up and down telling everyone how Amateur Index and I are such bad people. That I stold traffic.

I guess the man did not have his own house in order.

I think it is very topical to the dicsussion today. Of course he processes with ccbill as well.

I guess CAM would want to give this guy a medal!

Mike AI

Serge....noone will be doing any charity auction for
me... ;)
I have no friends in the internet world but my
2 partners....
CAM

Cam do you REALLY think teen girls are sitting around the mall and trying to find older men to help them put together a website so they can model on it? Have you ever talked to a teenage girl?! Running a website isn't exactly on their minds - they're more worried if Jim likes Sue or Fran and which eyeshadow makes their eyes look better.

These girls were solicited - plain and simple. I'd be willing to bet that "Teen Model" ads were put in AOL teen chat rooms, teen magazines, etc. The parents, just like the sickos that put makeup and hair extensions on 18 month old babies for beauty pageants, saw this is as a way to live their "popular" fantasy through their kids as well as pocket some $$$ in the process. The "older guys" (which so far, have shown to all have roots in pornography) have hit a gold mine - keep them clothed so the Feds don't bust them, but keep the peds teased enough fork out $19.95 a month for the looky-look.

Peaches

Mutt....I don't "mock" the laws, just point out holes in laws
and lines where laws and opinions blur.

....my charges have to do with controlled dangerous substances.....

I believe they "tried" to press charges for what I do for a living but
couldn't? haven't
been able to find that out yet as we're still before the "discovery" process.
They turned me in to the IRS and DEA....... IRS had to go back 10yrs of
my tax returns to find a $20 mistake.

But...they did a through check of my computer, tried to tell me I was going
to jail etc.... since I do nothing "illegal" as far as my business goes, they
had no charges in that area to press.

Children are already protected by the laws.

CAM

why won't CAM nail down an age?
Some 9 year old are very precocious
and quite mature. If a 9 year old wants to show his penis to dirty old men on the Internet he should have that right you are saying CAM?

i think that's your stance, since age according to you is much too subjective a thing to base laws on.
mutt

So...no one here would like a pimp,then?
Nick
******************

don't we have convicted PIMPS around here who cna shed the light on the question asked?
Serge

Nobody's skirting the issue of boy vs girls when it comes to sexual exploitation and abuse. But the fact of the matter is that the world of child pornography from the supply side and the demand side is 90%, probably higher, a male crime, gay and straight MEN.

And women who do exploit boys do get charged all the time. I have seen two news stories this week where a woman was the perpetrator, one in Staten Island NY.
Mary Kay LeTourneau, think that's her name, the school teacher who had the affair with the 13 year old is still serving time.
mutt

Cam,
what market do you see for a 15 yr old boy cam?
Nick

Cam, I'm not skirting the issue of girls/boys. I think that any sites that have boys in them that are under 18 wearing suggestive clothing that are run by pornographers and/or hosted by ISP's that cater to pornographers and/or are processed by billing companies that cater to porngraphers are JUST as bad. There may be a double standard in many MINDS as to underage sex acts, but there certainly isn't in the eyes of the law - ask Mary Kay Latourno.

Peaches

I myself will answer to
those charges.
CAM
*****************

...and who is gonna ask for Webmaster auction on your behalf?
Blondy?

Serge (How do you spell CONVERSIONS?)

I don't care if it's my neice or some other 15yr old, same
"rules" apply.

If she decided on her own to do it....who am I to tell her
she can't?
I surely can try and help her to understand what she
is doing and the concequences, but that is all I can do.

And I would surely do my best to protect her from "predators".

Peaches.....that is only one case, one person.... a little
out of context of my post.

Again....why does everyone skirt the issue of the young boy
older woman?
Why are all the problems everyone has with ONLY young girl
sites?

You don't apply the same "standards" to both sexes....the
LAW makes no such exceptions.
CAM

""the "older guy" is a CONVICTED child molester. ""

So...no one here would like a pimp,then?
Nick

I'm well aware of that as I am now in the process of fighting
the government for my freedom because I choose to do things
that our society has deemed I can't. I myself will answer to
those charges.
CAM
********************************

What did society say you couldn't do that now has you defending yourself in a court of law?

CAM you mock society's mores and laws. They ain't perfect that's for sure. But do you not agree that children need to be protected?
At what age do you think a child, girls in particular, become adults and don't need any laws which pertain only to them for their protection?

mutt

Cam,
I,in fact,take very few risks.:))

Its all a balance of risk and reward.

Moral issues aside,why would I,or pretty much most of the players on this board,open a nonnudeteen network and risk a multi-million business that complys with every law where it is based?

Makes no business sense.Hence I nor my corporations have no involvement.

Nick

There's got to be something legal about it.
********************

more than half of Florida drives without seat belts, me included.

Is it wide spread?
YES
is it legal?
NO
Serge (How do you spell CONVERSIONS?)

but then if the girl asks an older guy to put a site together and make money, he is now a child molester?
************************
Cam, with the sites I'm referring to, the "older guy" is a CONVICTED child molester. The courts put that title on him, not me. And some of the girls he's setting the sites up for are as young as 13.

Peaches

CAM age is no scape goat, it is determined by the laws of the country. The laws of the country, at least here in the US are dtermined by society.

So these are societies rules.

Stop equivicating, and mincing words...

Would you let you neice put up a site like these girls at 15? Would you let some guy set it up for her?

Mike AI

There are people who even think that guys like Nick are morally
and ethically bankrupt!?.....who cares!!?? :)

he chose's his own path and what risks and comfort
level he decides to live in.

CAM

SweetT...we haven't even touched on the subject
of stupidity! ;)
Mike......I also wasn't making a legal argument.

Yeh, so the people that run these types of sites
are "more than likely" morally or ethically bankrupt!?
So what? so most here think are beastiality, rape,
scat etc promoters.....again...so what? At least that's
what most of you think.
So are some CEO's of fortune 500 companies, so are
government officials and politicians and educators.

And then...it's ok for the girl to do it herself but
add a male to the equation that is older than her
and it's now not alright??

We can exploit an 18yr old but not a 17yr old? oh wait...
as long as it's another girl, or herself, or a boy that
is younger....it is ok??

but then if the girl asks an older guy to put a site
together and make money, he is now a child molester?

I could go on all day with this line of thinking.....

Again....everyone is using age as a scapegoat.
CAM

""well...it's nobody's problem.... ;) It's acceptable.
Switch the sexes around and all the sudden it
changes....age is just a "scapegoat" in this
argument.... :)
CAM ""

Cam,
Its the "double standard".Its the only thing we men have on our side.

;))
Nick

Serge,

Doesn't do any good. I even went so far as to call the guy who hosts this site. He promised me that he would 'look into it' and pull it if it was CP.

There's got to be something legal about it. ASACP got the call, I sent it to them months ago.
Drestin

mutt,
That's it in a nutshell :)
Nick

well i think that just like in real life, in cyberspace a 16 year old girl has the right to be a slut, she will have to deal with the ramifications later on if there are any. BUT the guy who is doing all their hosting, e-commerce etc is nothing more than pimping underage girls and he is a kiddy porner.

A girl on her own if she wants to flash her tits on the Net is fine,
An adult male who helps her do and charges money is scum.
mutt

mutt
how come michelle don't own her domain?
********************************

I notice that too. I think MikeAI is right, these girls don't own their sites.
I checked out camwhores.com which features Chellecam and it's run by the same guy who runs StileProject.com.
Check out camwhores.com, 200 webcams and the girls appear to be gorgeous. I wonder if the 200 girls know they are on that site.

mutt

Who signs the billing agrement with ccbill?
***********************

somebody who is VERY shy....

Registrant:
Stev Work Group
NONE
NONE, NONE 01234
AR

Domain Name: LOLITA-AGE.COM

Administrative Contact:
Kenning, Stev pokemon8773@yahoo.com
NONE
NONE, NONE 01234
AR
01234

Technical Contact:
Kenning, Stev pokemon8773@yahoo.com
NONE
NONE, NONE 01234
AR
01234

Billing Contact:
Kenning, Stev pokemon8773@yahoo.com
NONE
NONE, NONE 01234
AR
01234

Serge (How do you spell CONVERSIONS?)

Colin and CAM please note I did not say these sites are illegal, merely unethical. Many of them have exit consoles, and links that go to porn sites of legal teen girls. There is clear intent.

Do not kid yourself to think real girls are running the sites, they run their sites just like my models run theirs.

Some of these sites have multible girls on them, think a bunch of 15 year old girls from around the country get together to do this?

CAM there is no doubt most of these girls are fully and physcially grown. Most of them are beautiful girls, however the way they are being marketed, and the way it is set up leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

I read an article about the under age cam girls, all the little girls under 18 who have cams. Many of them get online and do silly stuff, including flashing men on the other side - who entice them with gfits and cash. I seriously doubt these girls have thought about the long term futures. They probably do not realize once you flash on the net once, even on a cam it will be on the net forever. I wonder how many of these girls will get bit in the ass by their stupid actions.

Peaches brings up an excellent point about adult supervision. To do anything, to sign any legal document a person has to be 18. So there is adults somewhere who is handling this? Their parents? The photographer? Some guy exploiting them. Who signs the billing agrement with ccbill?

As it relates to ccbill, if this was an isolated case it would be no big deal. But ccbill has shown blatent disregard for ethical, and the law. Their support of beasty sites, non-nude teen sites, lolita sites ( the one posted below look like kp to me), their past support of underage nude sites of child art, all brings me to only one conclusion.

Those who work for ccbill, support ccbill, own ccbill are vile scumsucking cockholsters! If ccbill was the last credit card processor on the net, I would go bankrupt before working with them.

It just amazes me how many apologist they have, what cretins!

Mike AI

CAM, Colin, et al....

There is illegal and then there is stupid....and they are not interchangeable....

For example: Calling the cop that just pulled you over a "dirty, rotten, no good, piece of shit" is not illegal.....but it doesn't mean that one should do it.

Another example: Dumping 330+ dead bodies in the backyard is not illegal.....but it don't make it a good idea. http://www.accessatlanta.com/ajc/metro/crematory/0226noble.html

Of course, this is just my opinion...I could be wrong.

--T

SweetT NationalNet

well...it's nobody's problem.... ;) It's acceptable.
Switch the sexes around and all the sudden it
changes....age is just a "scapegoat" in this
argument.... :)
CAM

mutt
how come michelle don't own her domain?
Meni (The Golden Tongue)

nobody even
cares about the young boy and the older girl
having sex! ;)
*************************

sure, it's HER problem!
;-)))
Serge

http://www.lolita-age.com/join/index.html

naaahhh.....CCbill just doesn't know they process lolitas and cater to the interests of pedophiles.

I think CCbill and Ibill qualify for:
"We are Innovators and not Immitators" award!
Serge

That was quite an extrapolation..... :P
Well, my point was made......nobody even
cares about the young boy and the older girl
having sex! ;)
CAM

I'll try and keep up as best as I can.... ;)
CAM

And BTW, there is something worse than CP on the internet...Something that is ruining lives and stopping work all over the nation (at least in my office)

Marbles...Fucking marbles...I dreamt of them last night. I can't eat without thinking of moving this piece of steak to put it next to the other steak and make room for the damn peas! I've organized my kitchen cabinets so that if I take out a can of mushroom soup, they all come out at once and the cream of broccoli falls into place. When I drive down the road, I imagine running into a blue car to see if he takes out six or seven more blue cars, I'm going crazy with colored marbles!
Drestin

Mutt,

Chris Rock tried out for MNF on his HBO show... it was a spoof on Monday Night Football.. hilarious

Get the Best of the Chris Rock show 2 on DVD.. you will be glad you did

Andy A Webmaster Central..... Got Content?

Most likely not....Italians don't put much
empesis on strait A's, they are just happy
that their kids get through school! :P
Doesn't matter as he's going to be part
of the family business..... ;)
CAM

CAM,
you are a bit slow today,
so I'll extrapolate it for you:

1) if the answer is YES,
that will be the end of it

2) if the answer is
NO, he is B's -
my responce will be:
he is not different that your brother you hate so much,
and she'll see the light and get involved with somebody more worthy

2B) NO, he is C and D -
my responce would be:
this is all happening because your mother is a fucking bitch and this would never happen if I was around!
and he even WORSE than your brother you hate so much,
and she'd see the light
and get involved with somebody more worthy
;-)))
Serge Lensman is a Prick

if you are not 'legally' an 'adult' can you 'legally' sign your Model Release?

I would guess that mommie or daddie would have to do that as guardian, huh?

fatbaby

Here's one that I came across several months ago that somebody was selling from my free host.

http://www.lolita-age.com/preview/tour2.html

I reported it to the ASACP and to CCBill. The site was never taken down, so I just assumed it must be legal, the girls must be of age. You take a look and tell me your opinions. No fucking way!
Drestin

No connection to the internet and the parents of
the boy who fucked your daughter are
Italian!
**********************

those answers will prompt the question #3:

is he a straight A student?
Serge

No connection to the internet and the parents of
the boy who fucked your daughter are
Italian!
CAM

surely it's not illegal to open a web hosting account and get third party credit card hosting for a 16 year old?
******************************
I know my son had a friend in HS that ran a very sucessful website selling tennis shoes and his parents had to get his hosting and credit card processing in place. You can't even get an AOL account if you're under 18 - here's part of their TOS:

To be an AOL member, you must be at least 18 years old. If you are not yet eighteen years old, you may still use AOL, but only if the account was created and registered by your parent or guardian.
Peaches

my second question will be:
Are they {parents} Jewish?
;-)))
Serge

.so, if your 16yr old daughter came
home and said she had sex with an 18yr old, you
would probably call the police and have him locked up?
or at least call his parents and have him grounded! :P
How about if your 16yr old son had sex with an
18yr old girl?
************************

my first question would be:
are they {parents} connected to the Internet?
Serge Lensman is a Prick

surely it's not illegal to open a web hosting account and get third party credit card hosting for a 16 year old? I ran my own little business when I was 16.
mutt

Here's another side of the arguement....

What do we think about boys and sexuality?
we've only talked about underage girls.

I know one thing..... I was horny and sexual
as soon as my first woody appeared! From that
point forward my brain was invaded with sexual thoughts! :O
I believe I was younger than 10?

Hypothetical question:......so, if your 16yr old daughter came
home and said she had sex with an 18yr old, you
would probably call the police and have him locked up?
or at least call his parents and have him grounded! :P
How about if your 16yr old son had sex with an
18yr old girl?

Probably pat him on the back and say good boy!!!!??
;)
CAM

what if the girls themselves are responsible for everything on their sites including the photos?
***************************
Then who signed the agreement with the hosting company? How about the credit card processor?
Peaches

what if the girls themselves are responsible for everything on their sites including the photos? What if the girl gets one of her also underage girlfriends to take the pictures of her half undressed?

I'm not an expert on this niche of the web but i think these girls, Pepper and Michelle are doing it on their own. But then again I am a sucker who once wrote one of MikeAI's girls a fan letter.

mutt

Does one have to sign a contract in order to have pictures of themselves fully clothed in the internet?
******************************
Since these are membership sites, surely there are contracts regarding how much these girls are paid?
Peaches

oh man i am so glad i'm not a parent. Reading these girls' sites they are so empowered by their sexuality nowadays. If i had a teenage daughter, i wouldnt be upset if she had a boyfriend and was having sex, i'd be happy that she wasn't a loser. But these young chicks are calling themselves 'whores' and they talk about going out to the mall to pick up guys for sex.

Today's young girls have turned into guys! Listen we all know teenage guys talk a big game, but you send out 4 15 year old boys to the mall to pick up chicks for sex and you know they are going to get NOTHING! You send 4 teenage girls to the mall to pick up guys for sex and you know they aren't coming home with their panties on!

on second though ...... it is much easier to have ugly daughters. Mel Brooks once was on Larry king and that was his best advice.
mutt

Does one have to sign a contract in order to have pictures of themselves fully clothed in the internet?
Colin TGP2.COM

Here's the way I look at it: 18 is, per the laws of the US (and yes, I realize a "w" in www stands for "world" ;)) a legal adult. This legal adult can sign and be responsible for a contract. So LEGALLY, should these pictures even BE on the internet? The girls aren't old enough to sign a contract/model release. These contracts/releases are being signed by Mommy and Daddy who see nothing but $$$ in their eyes.

As far as intent: in the situation I was referring to, the site was operated by a convicted child molester who also had other pornographic sites. I'm not sure how much closer to CP "intent" you could get :(

Then you get to the processing - these sites are being processed by companies that do the vast majority of their business through the pornography world.

So...you have a site filled with girls that cannot legally sign a contract/model release, they are run by pornographers and in some cases, convicted child molesters, and they are processed by billing companies who's main source of income is pornography.

IMO, it's obviously duck, duck, duck. :(

Peaches

go for it Meni. If you can get anywhere with Chelle I will call you THE MAN. She's not a stripper, and she appears to be very bright and talented.

Do you accept your mission?

mutt

she's cute as hell huh meni?

mutt

really? Chris Rock did try out for MNF? And they picked Dennis Miller over him? Dumbasses.

Ya know don't most TVs/VCR come with that additional audio track thing, maybe they should go with a system where people could pick their own announcing crews. Probably will someday.

I heard you could see Pam;s nipples through her top.

The R Kelly underage sex tape is up on websites they say.
http://www.opranoplus.com

mutt

mutt
that michelle chick is cute
should I hit on her?
Meni (The Golden Tongue)

Don't worry monk, time and thoughts are all I have right now..... :P
CAM

Cam,
Tell me about it! I've been exploited one way or another most of my life.

Damn! My pager just went off! Gotta go! Wish I could stay, but I gotta go be exploited again!:)))
Torone

Mutt, your right....society has to draw some lines, and they
have. These sites are working within those "lines" and maybe
even pushing those lines? But that is the right of each and
every individual here......to live your life as you see fit.
If YOU break a law, only you will have to answer to it!

I'm well aware of that as I am now in the process of fighting
the government for my freedom because I choose to do things
that our society has deemed I can't. I myself will answer to
those charges.
CAM

Mutt,

did you see chris rock do his "tryout" tape for monday night football?
it was on his hbo show.. that was a riot..

Man.. the best Stern was on E last night.. Pam Anderson.. holy smokes.. she is hot.. and I believe 18!
chris/pornoman Sexy Avs

CAM has not been posting for months... I think he was saving it up.

Don't blow your load all in one week CAM.

Monk

hmmmmmm.....meni are you listening to Stern now? I think he confirmed that he is talking to Fox about doing NFL football. Or was he goofing?

uh....i'm the biggest Stern fan around but this is a COLOSSAL mistake of EPIC proportions.
If these networks are now intent on putting non sports funny guys in the booth, first guy i'd go with is Chris Rock. If it was hockey, it would be Dennis Leary.
mutt

Torone....I don't believe i'm side stepping the issue?
You are pointing to hollywood as the culprit here, i'm not....
i'm just pointing out facts about age and sexuality.

and if you want to talk about legality.....well those sites
most definitely fall in the realm of a "legal site".

should a 13yr old be able to drink? I believe that choice
should be left up to the parents not the government.

Then I can argue......in most states I can die for my country
at the age of 18 but I can't drink in any bars untill i'm 21!

I'm not arguing any legality of these sites, just the "thinking"
behind the distress about them.

everyday people are exploited, and not just by pornographers!

CAM

WARNING!!!

For those who don't know this...Intent is a very big factor in criminal law!
Torone

Cam you're right but society has to draw a line somewhere, it's totally arbitrary, each state, culture, country makes its own call on it.
If we didn't draw the line we'd be failing hundreds of thousands of kids who would be exploited.

Life isn't black and white, unfortunately laws HAVE to be black and white.
mutt

Someone posted a site link one time to a girl in England that was like 16.. She had nude pics of herself and was a model..

I cant remember it now..
Im sure mikeai or brad is a member..
chris/pornoman Sexy Avs

and maybe sucking a little
dick........ what
should be done with you!?? ;)
*************************************

CAM,
Mike doesn't shoot dick content,
he has a "penis envy" syndrome
;-)))

Serge Lensman is a Prick

Cam,
I think you are sidestepping the issue. Would you say that we should allow 13-yo's to drink, or otherwise function as adults? The numbers are a function of law. The morality may well be a matter of personal feelings; but we have to police ourselves, or someone else will do it for us. Hollywood has no morals; and (because of their political ties) few legal restrictions.
Torone

interesting question about peppercherry.com. To me that isn't kp. It appears to be a really personal website run by a sexual 16
year old, very personal (if some dude put this together and it's a phoney site, he did a masterful job)
cybergrrl style.

Here's the interesting question, if a 14-17 year old girl wants to put up a website which include pics of her nude can she be charged with child pornography?

I linked from her site to http://www.chellecam.com who is the designer credited on the peppercherry site. Same type of site but Chelle is 18 and i guess legal. I clicked on something on Chelle's site which popped a console for a paysite called Whorecams or Camwhores..........this made me suspicious if it's not just some perv running these sites? To me that would make it kp. I think a 16 year old has a right to make a commercial website of herself, nude or non nude.
Would it make a difference if all her members were close to her own age?

Also, let's say it is her right to make a website of her personal life including nudity, she's forbidden from selling memberships because the guys who would buy memberships are probably purchasing child porn.

There's nothing illegal with a 16 year old girl having a sexual relationship with a 16 year old boy, why can't she sell memberships to 16 year old boys?

both sites are beautifully designed. I just don't get the feeling either site is kp.

Thurgood Marshall is the one who said 'I know pornography when i see it' .... i think we all have that philosphy.......i don't see it in that site.

mutt

The age of consent for sex is 16 in a lot of states

I thought I'd mention that
Meni (The Golden Tongue)

Sorry .. I just can't call that site "child porn" .. intent or not.

Child porn. from: http://www.pedowatch.org/pedowatch/definition.htm

"A visual depiction of an individual who is under 18 years of age or who appears to be under 18 years of age, engaged in sexually explicit conduct.

A visual depiction may also constitute child pornography if it is advertised, promoted, or presented in such a way that "conveys the impression" that the material contains a visual depiction of a minor engaging in sexually explicit conduct.

Sexually explicit conduct is defined as actual or simulated sexual intercourse, bestiality, masturbation, sadistic or masochistic abuse, or lascivious exhibition of the genitals. 18 U.S.C. 2256. "

I don't see anything that fits paragraph 3 in the preview. If one wants to get into nuances of law, I am sure there is a judge and a jury out that that would convict on intent. This is below my level of acceptable risk, however, I don't have a problem with it based on what I see in the preview area.

Colin Ask Colin

Oprano's Original Flat Board

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Oprano's Original Flat Board

messages number 60701 through 60800

messages
number 60701 through 60800