Serge,

There have been countless large mainstream sites affected before porn peddlers were touched by this type of strategy.

Obviously anything can be contested in the courts, however like I previously stated there ends up being somewhat of a contract signed. The AOL's, Yahoo's, Hotjobs, etc. have all been affected and haven't taken any action. I assure you they would of jumped on any type of legal recourse if they could of.

Now, they did take action when Gator replaced peoples banners, but that's a different deceptive practice.
KoKo SoftwareBucks.com

Anyone with good voyeur content, hit me up at luke@hirise.com.
Kahman Make $$$

ATTENTION ALL SPONSORS!
============================

there are those who believe that our rates are too high and they pointed me the space available somewhere:

go get it!!!!!

*************************************
yikes! adultwebmaster was giving me banner for $675.
*************************************

;-)))
Serge

All right I’m going to download it and check it out.

He can steal your home page and Search pages also, as long as he discloses that he's doing so. The contract the users sign is the fact that they agree to use Software that they are given for free, not the spyware itself but corresponding software.


KoKo SoftwareBucks.com

KoKO,
do you have a docket number and judge opinion or is it just heresay?
Serge

To ad to my previous post, as long as he doesn't redirect the traffic or take those type of measures. But he can send pop ups etc. when a surfer visits a designated sites.
KoKo SoftwareBucks.com

Koko, THEIR customers cannot sign a binding agreement giving him permission to jack YOUR pages or the ad space on your pages.

this guy must have some friends heh


dig420 Fetishbucks.com - We give you referrer stats!

It's the same principle as Gator I would assume mutt.

How it actually works may or may not be the same.

The potential for damage is enormous, there is no doubt about that.
KK conversions conversions conversions

mutt, LadyB, my counterpart from Voltar board did,
you can ask her directly at
http://www.vnwr.com/main/index.html
Serge

Mutt I don't believe it is but nobody will know for sure until this fucker gets sued, which I'm sure will be happening soon.

imho, the software that steals your homepage, search page, etc, wouldn't stand up in court either.

I HATE that shit!


dig420 Fetishbucks.com - We give you referrer stats!

Flashtrack isn't doing anything wrong, if they've acquired their customers through Opt-in measures.

Many companies have been doing this for over 2 years now. Just not targeting adult sites.
KoKo SoftwareBucks.com

GregP,
checks are a MUST and the company who's been in business the most is
http://achdebit.com

BPJ is not affraid to post his 800 number on the board,
I dealt with him for ages and
I don't know anybody even indirectly who had EVER complained about his service
Serge

dig i'm not saying it's a good thing. I'm asking if it's legal.

I'm not downloading it. it's obviously spyware. Where does it put the banner ads?
mutt

I have heard about the benefits of adding online cheques to paysites, but what is the best solution? Best company to use? Or are they all pretty much the same?
Right now I am using ibill for online chequing and am looking for something better.


GregP What is the best online cheque solution?

yeah i was thinking about that. Infringing on trademarks.

Who found this URL? I've never come across an ad for it. Looks to me like it's one of those things doomed to fail.


mutt

Mutt, if a guy sold space in your favorite armchair in your living room to winos who needed to take a rest, would you object?

these are MY pages which -I- have worked hard to brand and build traffic to, he has no right to usurp that traffic or profit off of my work.


dig420 Fetishbucks.com - We give you referrer stats!

Serge you are on the right track with permission.

I'd be interested in knowing just where the distribution point is for this.
KK conversions conversions conversions

.......its raining in SoCal!!........

anyways hello everyone!

serge... back on lastnights topic.. I do agree with alot of things its just the matter of figuring out what...lol

=)~
Glittergirl Ready? Set? Go!!!!

LadyB,
thanks for posting it!

Mutt,
does he have permission to use those domains for ANYTHING????


Serge

dig, why?

If a surfer downloads this extra piece of software voluntarily this Flash Track company seems to me to have the right to do whatever it wants.
The principle seems to be that if a surfer has this software working if he types in espn.com the software will serve up paid for sports type advertising, if he types in any of those adult URL's he gets paid for porn ads.

I don't see the illegality. I also dont see why a surfer would use the software unless he's getting paid. I thought those paid to surf things all went bust.


mutt

yes, Dig, getting sued for all him and his next 10 generations have or would have...
what a fucking prick!
Serge

Dig --

No comment other than we and several others are looking very strongly at the matter right now.
KK conversions conversions conversions

kk serge

oh MAN does this guy ever need his ass sued off! http://www.flashtrack.net/target_urls/adulturls.php
dig420 Fetishbucks.com - We give you referrer stats!

Dig,
I like
privaterooms.com
;-))

let's see what other guys say
;-))
Serge

Serge here are my domains to throw into the mix that might work:

sexunderground.com
privaterooms.com
sexualis.com

but pusi.com works for me as well.

cj, can you shoot me from the chest up? :)))




dig420 Fetishbucks.com - We give you referrer stats!

esco,
nothing in particular...
we had extra tar, feathers and he volunteered to be the
"poster Boy"
;-)))
Serge

oh hmmm.. what happened? and when did it happen? :)

I really need to speak with him and it seems he is not using icq or his @interclimax email anymore ??

thanks
esco Forest Where Are You?

Esco,
I haven't seen him,
I haven't talked to him,
he is NOT my relative and
one thing I can assure you...
you won't find him on this board, he was tarred and thrown out
;-)))
Serge

Heather of Ideepthroat

I think I'm in love.

Monk

Serge.. have you seen forest around? or talked to him anyways lately
esco Forest Where Are You?

Incidentally,
the new sponsor we starr on Nov 1st.
HAS a NEW product.

face everybody here know-
but only few know the product he has to offer
;-))

we'll see him around soon
;-)))
Serge

Hello everyone,
Im looking for a reputable company that can duplicate DVD and VHS and CD's asap. Im looking for about 6000 copies to start. If anyone has any info I would be grateful if you could email me with help. Thanks a million!
Heather Ideepthroat

Serge -- no one's saying there isn't check fraud -- but it is being reduced rapidly :)
KK
*********************

KK,
I'll discuss this topic with you in public only when your knowledge of the subject equals mine.

BPJ is a good sorce for starters.

I know what I am talking and sticking my reputation about.

if you rather play ostridge who hides his head under the wing and thinks that nobody sees him-
it's up to you.

I don't bullshit with serious matters as check processing.
Serge

About 2 years ago, we offered lower trial prices on checks than on credit cards.

By playing with the prices, we were able to get about 50/50 check and credit card joins.

Only problem with this, is that 20-40% on checks are bad from the start, and paying out webmasters $30-$40 per bad check can put a hurt a program. The idea of not paying webmasters on FRAUD checks is a good idea.
Brad Shaw Deep Oral Girls

Got it Kimmy. Thanks :-))

Ian $'s

Has anyone seen 'Forest' around? I notice he doesn't post really at all as of late and I need to speak with him urgently. Any info anyone has is very much appreciated

Thanks
esco Forest Where Are You?

doesn't look to me like that company is doing anything bad. Surfers have to download their software, when a surfer hits a specific URL ie. major porn sites, it'll pop up additional ads.
The surfer who comes to your site isn't your property exclusively. It just seems that's the way it oughta be.

But that Microsoft crap where keywords on MY html page become their property is criminal to me.

I really feel like the other shoe is about to drop. Hope i'm wrong.
mutt

Ian -- check your email :)

Serge -- no one's saying there isn't check fraud -- but it is being reduced rapidly :)
KK conversions conversions conversions

CactusButt
Great post!!! :D
LadyB

I just got a call from a bud and he says he got the e-mail so I guess I should read mine more carefully in future.

KK, is there a # I can call you at?

Ian $'s

KK, I know you did....my father still has Freud's original editions
;-)))

Ian,
don't bother with KK,
send me e-mail and I show you and all good guys I personally know how to increase your income using self assured KK's check processing.

Her check processing system she believes is a hard shit is nothing my kids who are REGULAR users,
can beat, and so can ANYBODY.

bpj,
if you can talk some sense into her-
please do that for her sake........
Serge

As I sit at my computer once again trying to log into my ibill stats (down again) and answering accounting as to why Epoch is behind again on partner payouts (late again), I find it funny that CCBill is being attacked since they are the only processor that I have never had a problem with. (I know there a couple other good ones, but I don't use them so can't speak on that).

CCBILL did indeed mail everyone about the cancellation e-mails. I received them at every e-mail address I have a ccbill account for. It explained exactly how the program worked, explained that hornybees was the default and that you get paid for it, and explained that you could easily log in and write your own cancellation e-mail that would override the hornybees e-mail.

I don't know about the rest of you, but the hornybees program is kicking ass on conversions and not only am I sending my cancels to it, I am sending other traffic there as well.




JMM (Oprano's Resident Satirist)

"What's up with this?
How do I make any money on it? "
--------------------

It's YOUR partner code in the email Ian -- every CCBill site was assigned one and if there are sales generated through the mailer YOU get paid on them as a partner, its a 50-50 split with the site owner. By that same token if a cancelled surfer signs up to your site, whoever they cancelled from gets half.

You emailed me about this, I told you where you could make the changes if you didn't want it set on default and explained in detail how it works.

Any more questions, by all means post them here.
KK conversions conversions conversions

"I'm on the phone right now about something much more important to talk to you. "
-----------------------

Actually I meant that sentence serge -- not the fact that we process checks and are satisfied with the way we do them.

KK conversions conversions conversions

Belive me, I agree totally.
Even though I am working for someone, I still am a "honey bee webmaster" that is definitely feeling the effects of "Sponsors getting smarter and maximizing their profits".

voodooman ZmAsTeR!

KK,
there is nothing to delete....

you know darn well that in respect to Bill I won't say a word,
'till one day when you get fuck in your ass due to your
"i had no clue"
;-)))

cheers!
Serge

Voodoo,
the issue Cactus Butt raises is MORE important than just
"sponsor doesn't pay you"

THINK about what he is saying!

I wouldn't wanna be in the "honey bee webmaster" shoes nowadsys.

The days when Rons of this world were paying for clicks based upon access logs are over.

Sponsors getting smarter and maximizing their profits as a SCIENCE at the expense of.....
Serge

Has anybody else seen this??

http://www.flashtrack.net/target_urls/adulturls.php

There's a huge list of very prominant domains listed here and this guy apparently is selling ad space to "cover up" existing ads on these domains??? According to what I've read he's even sueing people who bitch about it!

WTF?? wonder if I'll get sued for making this post lol : /
LadyB

The Three Metamorphoses

Three metamorphoses of the spirit do I designate to you:
how the spirit becometh a camel, the camel a lion,
and the lion at last a child.

Is it not this: To humiliate oneself in order to mortify one's pride?
To exhibit one's folly in order to mock at one's wisdom?


Vick An interesting world in which we live ... is that a good or bad thing?

CactusButt,

Sounds to me like you have a sponsor or two thats not paying you. Refer to Post # 27409.
:-)
voodooman ZmAsTeR!

BTW, speaking of processors; A few days ago someone mentioned that CCBill was using member's cancellation notices to promote other people's partnership programs.

Well, I checked and in my case the cancellation notice was upselling a site called honeybees or something and had a partnership url on it.

KK says that everyone using CCBill was e-mailed although none of the people i've spoken with over the last few days ever remember receiving one.

What's up with this?
How do I make any money on it?

Ian Permission?

That didnt come out right dammit, can you delete it???/
KK conversions conversions conversions

Its last Lord it here seeketh: hostile will it be to him, and to its last God; for victory will it struggle with the great dragon.

voodooman ZmAsTeR!

Good afternoon Oprano!

I have been doing this biz for a couple of years now, and this first post to Oprano is probably not the best way to introduce myself to those of yous who haven't seen me on "other" boards...

KK typed: "My suggestion if you have a paysite is to create an options page for your cc declines"

Afuckingmen KK!

I would just add one thing...If I sent "you" the click, and that click signs up, GOD FORBID, I would expect to get paid for it REGARDLESS of how they paid for their signup! Silly fucking me, I thought if I sent a sponsor a surfer and they signed up, I would get paid for the sale...

I only ask one thing of any paysite owner...We have a deal right???? I send you traffic, they sign up, you pay me! If not, fuck you, I'll just go back into my shell and look for other sponsors...

Most of "y'all" sponsors, no fingers pointed, I am already giving up my click to exit/entrance popup hell anyways...

They go to your site because I spent the time building the site, I spent the time submitting it, I burned and paid for the BW while they cruised my jpgs, I wrote the "great" text links that convinced the surfer to click on your banner instead of going back to where he/she could get 100,000 pics for free...I targetted him/her, I convinced him/her your site is the greatest thing since sliced bread, or Vasoline...tis up to YOU to convert him! And if you do, Goddamnit, I wanna be paid!

CactusButt Ladies! Click here to buy some chocolate to stick up your twat! :)

Serge,
We do process checks :)

I'm on the phone right now about something much more important to talk to you.
KK conversions conversions conversions

Voodo,
Zaratustra makes even Mr. Korbin look like a school boy
Serge

Voodoo, does name
Zaratustra
says somethign to you?
Serge

hahaha, well shit.
My bad!

There are no monsters (...)

Visa/MC are not monsters either ... they are just trying to make a buck.
Dont you feel sorry for them? ;+))
voodooman ZmAsTeR!

Visa/MC <<== Monsters

Shhhhhh, I'm trying to be anon VM!
NotAnthony

Mutt, did you see the Attorney Generallast night making that announcement that something bad was coming. They don't make those kind of announcements without the threat being very real. Tatical nuclear weapons .... sounds good to me. :)



RichC Monday Mania Is $60 Joins On Kara's Next Week!

Anthony

There are no monsters in this biz.
voodooman ZmAsTeR!

He who fights monsters...
...

"Is there anything that can be done to minimize risk with ACH? To make surfers feel more secure?
geeky
"

Geeky,
the best what can be done is to post on every website:
"when you look into abyss,
the abyss is starring back at you"

I'm sure this would help tremendously!
;-)))

Serge

KK,
if you do not process them and just talk from your theoretical points of view,
I'll wait 'till you do to discuss the pitfall you might not have any ideas they exist.

somehow, your post makes me believe that you only have theoretical background on the subject.
Serge

Ah but Serge, walk across the street and you can get hit by a bus.
KK
*******************

KK,
do you process checks?
Serge

"If Serge shaves, but everyone else does too, is it shaving?"
Meni

If everyone is shaving, I guess that includes Jennacash?

Monk

interesting. thanks for the info guys.

Is there anything that can be done to minimize risk with ACH? To make surfers feel more secure?
geeky

A sheep in wolf's clothing?



Cleo

Ah but Serge, walk across the street and you can get hit by a bus.
KK conversions conversions conversions

bpj,
pleasure chatting with you,
and as they say in Russian
"The devil is much less scarrier than it's portrayed"
;-))

thanks!
Serge

Serge call me back.... can't seem to get through to that number.

bpj

bpj,
I left you my number on your machine,
let's chat!
Serge

Geeky,
they have a good reason to be worried.


Serge

Compared to CC's.... there are none! ;-)" ?
**************************
uh, ok.... Compared to cc's, they are MINIMAL! ;-)

I guess they are afraid their bank accounts will be vulnerable, or they are safer with Visa, etc.
*********************************
This is true! Surfers ARE safer w/ cc's!


bpj ACHdebit.com - Got Checks???

I guess part of the ACH popularity equation is getting surfers to pull out their checkbooks instead of a credit card. It is funny, a lot of people have no problem using a credit card online, but don't want to use a check online. I guess they are afraid their bank accounts will be vulnerable, or they are safer with Visa, etc.
geeky

mutt,
I give it
"within 10 years"
that this si going to happen.

I WISH myself to be wrong, but I don't think so this time
;-(((
Serge

KK, bpj, will you be very upset if I contradict you regarding:

"Compared to CC's.... there are none! ;-)" ?

this is Oprano, guys,
and you know what that means
;_))

you have a chance to re-word your post.


Serge

ok on what should be a fun day for American families, Halloween, World Series, Michael Jordan returns to basketball.......a High Security Alert. New Jersey woman dying of anthrax in NYC hospital, no connection to government mail facility, they are now attacking private citizens mailboxes.
Another story advises we need BILLIONS of dollard to fight BIOTERRORISM.

What the fuck are we doing here? How can America let itself be abused like this by these fucking mutants?

There is only one solution to this mess we didn't start.
I don't how much notice we should give them, I don't want kids to die, BUT dropping a nuke is our only way out of this. Of course if people are ready to live like rats in a cage, perpetually worried about their kids futures, we can just go on as we are. Bombing the hell out of the shithole of Afghansistan to no end.


mutt

"The biggest risk to paysites is NOT accepting checks! imo ;-) "
--------------------------

I absolutely agree.

KK conversions conversions conversions

What do you see as negatives for ACH? Bounced checks? Fraud? Is fraud harder?
geeky
**********************************
Compared to CC's.... there are none! ;-)
Since WTS does not charge a penny for bounced checks this is irrelevent! (processing fees on COLLECTED funds only!)
AND, since our system allows proggy's to pay out webmasters on SETTLED check signups... majority of risk disappears there too!
Along with the utilization of proprietary fraud controls, a very persistant collections dep't and the timely manner in which WTS gets the returns back, fraud becomes even less of an issue as well!

The biggest risk to paysites is NOT accepting checks! imo ;-)

bpj ACHdebit.com - Got Checks???

sykkboy, ya sure?
:-))))
cj (vaginator) $70 for every FREE signup!

Check subscribers stay longer and are much less of a hassle in the end than credit cards.

While banks will occasionally issue a refund on a check, there currently are no fines or penalties assessed other than the charge from the bank for a bounced or bad acct etc.

If you run a webmaster program, paying per join, there's a simple way to cut down alot of the fraud -- hold the payouts back a week to ten days on check joins and deduct the bum checks from the reseller stats. This keeps you from paying on bad joins and keeps your resellers from trying to fuck you over.

I took a look at some numbers last week and the pricepoint for checks is NOT the same as credit cards. Lower priced trial, higher priced recur actually seems to retain BETTER in everything I looked at. The number of rebills with checks is well more than with cc's.

My suggestion if you have a paysite is to create an options page for your cc declines (while still giving them the check option on the join page too) that basically says, your card was declined, click here to try another card, here to write an online check or here to use a dialer. By letting the surfer choose you stand to gain alot more than by automatically throwing them over to another cc processor -- they may only have one card in their wallet, but I'll guarantee you they pay that bill with a check every month. :)


KK conversions conversions conversions

Anthony,
you, Kaiser, and Netpond jerks who
bloked Oprano
really pissed me off.

When I am pissed off -
I think.

When I think-
I come with ideas.

When I come with good ideas -
I make money.

When I make money-
it's only a matter of time
'till I get pissed off again
;-)))

you'll be sorry one day you dropped the fucking ball!

P.S.
how does it feel to be in the same company you were once before????
;-)))

hahhaahahhaahhahahaha!
Serge

bpj,

thanks! this very educational for all of us I am sure. What do you see as negatives for ACH? Bounced checks? Fraud? Is fraud harder?
geeky

I have some ideas going thru my head, I offered something similar to Anthony few months back and he didn't jump on it due
as he put it
"not enough money"
but I still have it in my head.
-===================================

You make me sound like I'm all about the Money and nothing else!!!

Well... It's true. =o)

Anthony

what would you do if not able to accept checks online?
**************************
guess I would be forced into early retirement, maybe start a webmaster resource site..... and hang out on the boards all day! ;-))) lol

BigDog - got it! ;-)

bpj

will ACH be the next victim?
*********************************
Although NACHA rules have become tighter, I see very little risk of ACH going away! In fact, it is still in its infancy.... ;-)
Also, one should remember that with ACH, the risk is spread across the multitude of banks that are being debited! Your risk does not lie with JUST Visa or MC....

bpj

Blondy, I had Pitt in my oprano pool. But I think our bet means
you get on top for 69.
cool
Vegas 7-12 i'm in town

Meni (The Golden Tongue)

damnit, no wonder my ears were burning while I was trying to sleep...

yeah, cj can do wonders in photoshop...but cj, I was under the impression that you were going to make my shlong look BIGGER...not smaller... ;))

and you know I'd do anything for you cj, but I'd have to draw the line at shrubbery in my butt....if I wanted horticultural items in my ass, I'd shoot for the Sweets ;))))


SykkBoy $42 per trial signup, 110 sites to promote

Big Dog,

Thanks for that info! I think last year a usual percentage was about 10%. That is the kind of growth I expected.

Have you found any negatives about it?
geeky

BigDog - never saw your fax 512-263-3099

Are they a significant percentage for paysites??
*********************************
I think checks represent appx 20% on average. We do have some clients who discount the price of check joins to cc's and experience as high as 40%-50% check signups! ;-)

bpj

any Cockholster sightings today?

Somebody ripped you off? Found a new scam? Spammer? Bad sponsor? Content thief?
Make him/her Cockholster of The Day!
Send nominations to muttAToprano.com

How do these new credit card regulations affect PayPal? I still don't fully understand PayPal. Are they a third party processor in the same way CCBILL,IBILL etc are?
Are many paysites using Paypal? Are there fines for chargebacks passed on to the person selling whatever it is they are selling?

mutt Home of the The Golden Cockholster Award!

also,

bpj,

will ACH be the next victim? what would you do if not able to accept checks online?

geeky

Geeky...Checks run about 25% of our total revenue right now...
also rebilling is higher and retention is higher.

Best of all,NO CHARGEBACKS!
BigDog Big Dog's get up to $45!!

Oprano Opinion time: ;-))

I was just curious.. with Visa possibly cracking down and making things more difficult... what are the best _other_ solutions and their strengths and weaknesses?

Checks - I am sure the percentages of people using them has gone up in the past year. Are they a significant percentage for paysites??

Dialers - I know they are used a lot across the pond, but are they given a bad name by the scams??

Anything else out there??


geeky

Meni darling, Pittsburg won.

So is there a good sushi bar in Vegas?
Blondy Don't miss your chance @ this flat screen TV

Online Cipro under attack...
http://www.wral.com/news/1033616/detail.html


geeky

sharky - sure! hit me up this afternoon to discuss.... 800-982-9366

bpj

Meni,
I realised that in 1997...
what took YOU that long????


Serge

If Serge shaves, but everyone else does too, is it shaving?

Serge this is similiar to the tree falling in the woods scenario.


Meni (The Golden Tongue)