The biggest difference between the business now

[Osiris]

Nick, wouldn't PPS be the same in the sense of processors? I mean, if a PPS only has one processor, and that processor went out of business, that sponsor might not be able to pay. Didn't this happen with a few PPS programs before?

[Nickatilynx]

Originally Posted by Osiris

Nick, wouldn't PPS be the same in the sense of processors? I mean, if a PPS only has one processor, and that processor went out of business, that sponsor might not be able to pay. Didn't this happen with a few PPS programs before?

It does happen.

So you lose a weeks traffic.....

With a Revshare you have lost the major profit element you hoped to earn by taking the long money

[Nickatilynx]

""TheEnforcer, it's understandable in the example to take the 1 time payment of 10,000 vs. annual payments of 2k over a 5 year period, just an example. But it doesn't quite work like that with revshare. With revshare, as long as the site converts and you can build up and maintain 10k a month, that's 10k per month for as long as the site rebills. ""

Whats your average earn per join?

[Osiris]

Originally Posted by Nickatilynx

""TheEnforcer, it's understandable in the example to take the 1 time payment of 10,000 vs. annual payments of 2k over a 5 year period, just an example. But it doesn't quite work like that with revshare. With revshare, as long as the site converts and you can build up and maintain 10k a month, that's 10k per month for as long as the site rebills. ""

Whats your average earn per join?

PPS: $35
Revshare: $10-$15



Enforcer, good points!

[TheEnforcer]

Originally Posted by Osiris

PPS: $35
Revshare: $10-$15



Enforcer, good points!

I think he's talking about what your average TOTAL value for a signup is for rev share. IE- over the life of your average recurring member how much money do you make off of them?

[Osiris]

Originally Posted by TheEnforcer

I think he's talking about what your average TOTAL value for a signup is for rev share. IE- over the life of your average recurring member how much money do you make off of them?

Derrrrr! LOL

Ok, depending on the site a member usually stays on average 3 months. So 30.00-45.00

[Nickatilynx]

Originally Posted by Osiris

Derrrrr! LOL

Ok, depending on the site a member usually stays on average 3 months. So 30.00-45.00

OK sparky....

LOL

You do the math....

I can have $35..RIGHT NOW! No risk. You can go bankrupt the day after my wire comes in... ;-))

Or I can wait 3 months to collect between $5 LESS or $10 more....

Hmmm...wonder what anyone in their right fucking mind would pick...

;-))

[Nickatilynx]

You are new to this huh???

..let me help ya a tad...

""Recent test we have done show that the average earn to a revshare webmaster would be $57.84 over the life of the member"

;-))

[Osiris]

Originally Posted by Nickatilynx

You are new to this huh???

..let me help ya a tad...

""Recent test we have done show that the average earn to a revshare webmaster would be $57.84 over the life of the member"

;-))

Mind saying what program that's with?


Maybe I'm seeing things wrong. But I see no harm in building up a nice recurring, month after month 5-10k income. It may take a little while to get there. But once it's there, it's there if the members you get stay. This depends on the sponsor also.

I like PPS, I'm just trying to understand the beef people have with revshare..

[Nickatilynx]

Originally Posted by Osiris

Mind saying what program that's with?


Maybe I'm seeing things wrong. But I see no harm in building up a nice recurring, month after month 5-10k income. It may take a little while to get there. But once it's there, it's there if the members you get stay. This depends on the sponsor also.

I like PPS, I'm just trying to understand the beef people have with revshare..

ummmm it isn't from a program..its what you SHOULD be saying about the one you are marketing ..because you just said on Revshare I may make less per join than from your PPS LOL

;-))))

and by your own figures you are saying I will earn 30 -45 per join..on YOUR revshare model....but it will take me three months to get that return

I'd take the $35 now...

[sudden]

If a program can make $55-60 from a signup on average, there's going to be programs that pay $35 per signup upfront - why take revshare?

The only reason I can think of, would be if there was a program that converted outrageously high - and only offered revshare. But chances
are if they did convert that well, it wouldn't take long for them to arrange for a funds reserve to be able to do upfront PPS.

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by sudden

If a program can make $55-60 from a signup on average, there's going to be programs that pay $35 per signup upfront - why take revshare?

The only reason I can think of, would be if there was a program that converted outrageously high - and only offered revshare. But chances
are if they did convert that well, it wouldn't take long for them to arrange for a funds reserve to be able to do upfront PPS.

You've been getting my skype's? Need wiring info.

Thanks mate!

[Timon]

Originally Posted by sudden

If a program can make $55-60 from a signup on average, there's going to be programs that pay $35 per signup upfront - why take revshare?

The only reason I can think of, would be if there was a program that converted outrageously high - and only offered revshare. But chances
are if they did convert that well, it wouldn't take long for them to arrange for a funds reserve to be able to do upfront PPS.

The one advantage of revhare is that Epoch is much better at counting than most paysite owners are

[TheEnforcer]

It's not so much a beef as it is as that a business can be built faster under PPS with less risk.

[Osiris]

I'm starting to see the light..

[Jeremy]

Only using revshare is like *only* using console-free links.

Revshare sign-ups make $28 - $30 over the life of a member.

Add in that a $30 full-price sale is much harder to convert than a $4.95 trial (which may be evened out by the PPS shave) and it becomes clear that PPS is the only way to go.

There may be the odd site / program where you can make more than $30 on revshare, but the relative cost of finding them makes it prohibitive.

[Jeremy]

Morgan: *burp* *scratch* *fart* huh, wassat? It's like y'know, like.... y'know? *sniff*

Drav: I was going to write that "we still wuv ooo" but I figured that probably wasn't going to make you feel any better whatsoever.

[MorganGrayson]

Originally Posted by Jeremy

Morgan: *burp* *scratch* *fart* huh, wassat? It's like y'know, like.... y'know? *sniff*

Drav: I was going to write that "we still wuv ooo" but I figured that probably wasn't going to make you feel any better whatsoever.

Actually, Jeremy, I think you made *two* of us take a health plunge with that post.

You can go back to being polite and articulate now. Please.

[Dravyk]

Originally Posted by Jeremy

*burp* *scratch* *fart* huh, wassat? It's like y'know, like.... y'know? *sniff*

For a moment there, I thought Inabon was posting!

[DannyCox]

Originally Posted by Nickatilynx

and back when I started in 1996/1997 is this...

In 1996 the vast majority of people involved in this games ambition was to make millions a year , minimum 250k a yr.

Now the vast majority ambition is to make beer money or just around the same as they could make at a "real" job.

It is a major difference in mindset.

I would agree with you for 1997, but 1996 was a totally different time. The concept of sponsorship had just started, and very few were actually doing it. Xpics came out with the monthly percentage share of a set amount based on traffic sent, and Webpower started their $0.01 Raw Click promotion. It was very late 1996 and early 1997 when we saw the jump into higher pay-outs and PPS.

In 1996, we didn't fully understand what we had or where we were going. None of us "knew" this business as it was still in it's infancy, so we all ended up pioneering various techniques for traffic, conversion and retention. Many of which are still employed to this day. We had the handful of serious businessmen, and a lot of "Playas" (sounds like today, doesn't it) who were happy riding on the coattails of others, and making their "beer money".

With the demise of the original YNOT message board, and the proliferation of other webmaster boards, the real bullshit and cock-swinging started. The "Big Boys" were all trying to out do one another with higher and higher pay-outs, seeing huge revenue but taking a massive hit on pay-outs (just never made business sense to me). That was 1997.

I always stayed fairly quiet and behind the scenes, and have enjoyed good success all these years. My mindset in this is still the same as it was back when we started making real money; maximize revenues and minimize expenses to obtain true profit.

We still get people coming to us all the time thinking they can just throw up a website and get rich. Truthfully, I doubt the average person just coming into this today can even make beer money! People look at our success and think they can do it too. They tend to forget that we have been doing this for over eleven years now, and paid our dues those first few years. They also expect you to hold their hands, and guide them through the learning curve involved. While I'm happy to give basic advice, like most I keep the good stuff I know close to me.

I just consider myself an average "webmaster", but these days I just work on projects that hold an interest to me. My "cash cows" are out there running well, which gives me the ability to "play" with new ideas. We are still more than willing to work with others on projects, but we do tend to be selective on what we work on and who we work with.