XBIZ Summer FORUM VEGAS, The Pictures, from F.U.B.A.R.

[JFK]

You know, damned if you do , damned if you dont........For years people have complained that there were just way too many affiliate reps at the shows, not enough owners and top level decison makers.

Then you get a show, where the afformentioned people show up and low and behold some attendees are saying, where are all the people of past shows? Do you want QUALITY or Quantity ? Do you want to Party or there for business ?

The business has changed a great deal over the past couple of years, the party animals have fallen by the wayside, giving room for serious business people to network and make money.

We had a cabana, picked up new business and quite a few leads to follow up on. The people who were there to work, succeded at it. The Show was QUALITY, we will be there next year with bells on !!

Check out the pics,
http://www.fubarwebmasters.com/index1.php

[DannyCox]

We stopped going to shows years ago as neither Carol or I are into the parties. It seemed the shows became about the parties with everything else being secondary. It was a bit difficult to do business with people who were drunk all the time and only seemed to care about the parties!

We're talking about hitting a couple of shows to see how they are these days. The problem is...I don't know anybody anymore!

[JFK]

Originally Posted by DannyCox

We stopped going to shows years ago as neither Carol or I are into the parties. It seemed the shows became about the parties with everything else being secondary. It was a bit difficult to do business with people who were drunk all the time and only seemed to care about the parties!

We're talking about hitting a couple of shows to see how they are these days. The problem is...I don't know anybody anymore!

Danny, not knowing anyone could be a good thing Fresh ideas

[Toby]

Originally Posted by JFK

Danny, not knowing anyone could be a good thing Fresh ideas

And all your old jokes will be fresh material again.

[gonzo]

Originally Posted by DannyCox

We stopped going to shows years ago as neither Carol or I are into the parties. It seemed the shows became about the parties with everything else being secondary. It was a bit difficult to do business with people who were drunk all the time and only seemed to care about the parties!

We're talking about hitting a couple of shows to see how they are these days. The problem is...I don't know anybody anymore!

In all sincerity danny... Im considering skipping all the B2B shows this year.
Vegas ROI was abysmal at best and expensive as fuck.

[softball]

Originally Posted by gonzo

In all sincerity danny... Im considering skipping all the B2B shows this year.
Vegas ROI was abysmal at best and expensive as fuck.

see my rant.....

[Hell Puppy]

I'll go to another show this year if I have something I need to accomplish that needs me to be face to face with a few people. That's getting even more rare than normal for me. I tend to do my own thing, show it to no one and be as self sufficient as possible.

Either that or someone puts a show someplace I wanna go during a time I'm in mood to mix business and pleasure.

The Atlanta Forum is a no brainer for me since that's backyard and Natnet.

Beyond that, dunno, not much out there screaming out to me. Would love to see a show in Tampa, Nawlins or maybe someplace midwest or Denver.

[LAJ]

Cybernet Expo anyone??

[JFK]

Originally Posted by LAJ

Cybernet Expo anyone??

SPAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMMMMMMMM

[LAJ]

Originally Posted by JFK

SPAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMMMMMMMM

LOL... sorry for jackin the thread here but since there is this talk about quality over quantity and needing ROI... that simply describes OUR show.

[softball]

Originally Posted by JFK

SPAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMMMMMMMM

Oh come on JFK don't be getting precious, this is nothing new to you....lol

[connor]

Originally Posted by DannyCox

We stopped going to shows years ago as neither Carol or I are into the parties. It seemed the shows became about the parties with everything else being secondary. It was a bit difficult to do business with people who were drunk all the time and only seemed to care about the parties!

We're talking about hitting a couple of shows to see how they are these days. The problem is...I don't know anybody anymore!

Hey Danny -

I am pretty sure that you and Carol used to be big supporters of Cybernet Expo back when Fay owned the show. I know you guys were at IA2000 as well, and to be honest... I have very fond memories of those early days.

We'd absolutely LOVE to have you two at Cybernet Expo. Fay doesn't own the show anymore, YNOT does, but I think you'll find that although we do have a lot of very fun parties in the evenings, the days are 100% business. It's a smaller show, like it always has been, but there will be a good sized crowd still ... and I'm VERY proud of the lineup of panels and classes this year.

Take a look at the site, and please feel free to hit be up if you want to talk about anything. connor at ynot dot com.

Since YNOT took over that show, we've been shouting from the highest rooftops about ROI and business. We've pretty much been alone in focusing first on business and education, parties second... not as glamorous a message, but somehow I have a feeling that others will be following our lead on 2010.

Parties are a great way to unwind in the evenings, and do a little extra networking... but I completely agree, there has to be ROI for attendees and sponsors first and foremost.

[gonzo]

Originally Posted by connor

Hey Danny -

I am pretty sure that you and Carol used to be big supporters of Cybernet Expo back when Fay owned the show. I know you guys were at IA2000 as well, and to be honest... I have very fond memories of those early days.

We'd absolutely LOVE to have you two at Cybernet Expo. Fay doesn't own the show anymore, YNOT does, but I think you'll find that although we do have a lot of very fun parties in the evenings, the days are 100% business. It's a smaller show, like it always has been, but there will be a good sized crowd still ... and I'm VERY proud of the lineup of panels and classes this year.

Take a look at the site, and please feel free to hit be up if you want to talk about anything. connor at ynot dot com.

Since YNOT took over that show, we've been shouting from the highest rooftops about ROI and business. We've pretty much been alone in focusing first on business and education, parties second... not as glamorous a message, but somehow I have a feeling that others will be following our lead on 2010.

Parties are a great way to unwind in the evenings, and do a little extra networking... but I completely agree, there has to be ROI for attendees and sponsors first and foremost.

I think the parties last year were some of the best Ive ever attended at a show. Fuck I went to a DMoney party even and it was one of the highlights of the show.

[connor]

Originally Posted by gonzo

I think the parties last year were some of the best Ive ever attended at a show. Fuck I went to a DMoney party even and it was one of the highlights of the show.

Thanks man, and yeah they were pretty fun. But it was kept to the evenings, with business in the day. That's the tricky part in delivering this message... I don't mean to suggest in ANY way that the parties at Cybernet are second to anyone, but from the POV of the show organizers, our first concern is making sure there's business and education going on in the daytime. Hopefully that was the case for you last year as well.

We added the "Intensive Training" classes to this year's lineup, and also added some new workshops on producing content. Dave Cummings will be teaching a class on shooting and producing adult videos, and Spannow and Belinda will be doing a live photo shoot with Emily Saint. Also an increased focus on organic traffic generation, buying traffic, social networking, etc.

Please bookmark this thread for when people are copying us in 2010 so we can point back to it! Haha.

[LAJ]

[connor]

Originally Posted by LAJ

Haha... sorry man, I just think this topic is so important... the issue of quality over quantity, ROI, focus on business, etc. That, and I completely miss seeing Carol at shows.

So really, just agreeing with JFK... quality is everything.

[gonzo]

Originally Posted by connor

Thanks man, and yeah they were pretty fun. But it was kept to the evenings, with business in the day. That's the tricky part in delivering this message... I don't mean to suggest in ANY way that the parties at Cybernet are second to anyone, but from the POV of the show organizers, our first concern is making sure there's business and education going on in the daytime. Hopefully that was the case for you last year as well.

We added the "Intensive Training" classes to this year's lineup, and also added some new workshops on producing content. Dave Cummings will be teaching a class on shooting and producing adult videos, and Spannow and Belinda will be doing a live photo shoot with Emily Saint. Also an increased focus on organic traffic generation, buying traffic, social networking, etc.

Please bookmark this thread for when people are copying us in 2010 so we can point back to it! Haha.

You arent going to have a debate with preacher Donnie?

[connor]

Originally Posted by gonzo

You arent going to have a debate with preacher Donnie?

You mean that dude from Chico? If you've ever been to Chico, you'd know why he was that way.

[gonzo]

Originally Posted by connor

You mean that dude from Chico? If you've ever been to Chico, you'd know why he was that way.

I figured it was becasue you were a fag that wore white socks with boots.... not that there is anything wrong with that!

[DannyCox]

Originally Posted by connor

I am pretty sure that you and Carol used to be big supporters of Cybernet Expo back when Fay owned the show. I know you guys were at IA2000 as well, and to be honest... I have very fond memories of those early days.

Yep, we used to sponsor the show for Faye in the beginning, and helped out quite a bit, even when it was AdultDex then xWebExpo! Our first show was the very first IA2000 one where they allowed us strange Internet people in to join all the Phone Sex guys! I think there was 50 of us total, all hanging out in the hotel bar

I've always enjoyed the CybernetExpo shows as I prefer the smaller more intimate events. In the early days the IA2000 then AVN shows were fun, with a lot of great networking. Then the "big boys" all had to start waving their cocks around and playing who has the biggest dick when it cames to parties, and that's all that events seemed to turn into...a place to party and nothing else. We decided to just stay away.

Part of our problem with traveling is that my mother has been very ill these past 6 years, and we had no one else to watch our young son. Not even for just a few days. But we do hope to get out and start networking again. In this economy, my retirement plans have been a little delayed and I actually have to do work again!

[connor]

Originally Posted by DannyCox

Yep, we used to sponsor the show for Faye in the beginning, and helped out quite a bit, even when it was AdultDex then xWebExpo! Our first show was the very first IA2000 one where they allowed us strange Internet people in to join all the Phone Sex guys! I think there was 50 of us total, all hanging out in the hotel bar

I've always enjoyed the CybernetExpo shows as I prefer the smaller more intimate events. In the early days the IA2000 then AVN shows were fun, with a lot of great networking. Then the "big boys" all had to start waving their cocks around and playing who has the biggest dick when it cames to parties, and that's all that events seemed to turn into...a place to party and nothing else. We decided to just stay away.

Part of our problem with traveling is that my mother has been very ill these past 6 years, and we had no one else to watch our young son. Not even for just a few days. But we do hope to get out and start networking again. In this economy, my retirement plans have been a little delayed and I actually have to do work again!

My first IA2000 was Orlando, not sure if that's the one you mean, but my experience was exactly what you described. I forget the name of the hotel on I-Drive, the Clarion maybe?, but there was a little bar area in the lobby and we all hung out there most of the time. In the exhibit area, the phone sex guys were looking at us with, "You're the bastards who killed our business!" lol Was that the same year the Fabulous Thunderbirds played?

And yup... I definitely remember the path that shows took from that point forward. Money was so easy to make back then it was absurd, so the shows were elaborate, way too much was spent on booths and parties, etc. But still... some good times too. Wish I could do it one more time.

Totally get the travel issue... I have a nine year old and if not for his mother, I'd be in a similar situation with travel. Maybe we'll have a chance to get you guys out to SF in 2010?

[softball]

Dave Cummings will be teaching a class on shooting and producing adult videos,

Say it ain't so. You mean you have to provide parking for the talent?

[RawAlex]

Many of you know here that I had in the past attended shows on a very regular basis, and had a (minor) hand in the running of some shows in the past (particularly helping out on the cybernet shows in Montreal).

The show business hit a wall a couple of years ago, with way too many events, way too many hangers on, and way too much bullcrap in general. Most of the shows declined because the big wigs are nowhere to be found (they no longer want to mix with the masses), and the shows themselves became a bit of a joke. It turned into a chance for a bunch of surfmasters to mooch free drinks and drool on porn girls, and for program reps to get drunk and throw stuff off of balconies.

I attended the Vegas show(s) in January, spending some time hanging around in the AEE show (thanks to Bangwang for the comfortable seat with a view) and then went to the webmaster show at the hard rock (thanks to AK from Dating Gold for the pass). The Hard Rock show pretty much clued me in that if anything, the AVN style shows have gotten worse. It was hard to find people, it was hard to get business done, and many companies and their friends were in fact hiding out in skyboxes ignoring the world. Only a few companies like DG were open to having signficant numbers of visitors in their world.

I however made a grand playing poker at the MGM, and the airfare and whatnot was cheap.

It also appears that AVN is getting seriously hurt by XBIZ shows. Normally by this time of the year the Florida show is the talk of everyone in the industry, for the moment it seems to be a afterthought on some boards, rarely mentioned otherwise.

Cybernetexpo appears (I haven't attended) to have turned the corner and made the shows more relevant again, getting people together and giving them the chances to interact. It appears to once again get the top people and the bottom together in one place, which allows things to happen.

[Hell Puppy]

Originally Posted by rhetorical

Say it ain't so. You mean you have to provide parking for the talent?

hehehehehe....

I always thought we pampered OUR talent too much, but Dave is in another stratosphere. hell, he makes me wanna do a shoot with him.

[LAJ]

Dave is a helluva guy no question about it.

I guess it's just a matter of time before another show asks him to do a workshop at theirs.

[DannyCox]

Originally Posted by connor

My first IA2000 was Orlando, not sure if that's the one you mean, but my experience was exactly what you described. I forget the name of the hotel on I-Drive, the Clarion maybe?, but there was a little bar area in the lobby and we all hung out there most of the time. In the exhibit area, the phone sex guys were looking at us with, "You're the bastards who killed our business!" lol Was that the same year the Fabulous Thunderbirds played?

Yes, it was the Clarion on International Drive. It was the second Orlando show when the Fabulous Thunderbirds played. The first show there really had nothing going on, which is why we all hung out in the lobby bar and really networked. Many of the future "Big Boys" got there start right there at that first show.

That first year, there wasn't a single booth set up on the floor for the Adult Internet, it was all Phone Sex stuff, and pretty boring. I still have a vivid memory of Lensman walking around looking lost most of the time and trying to learn this newfangled Internet thing

[Hell Puppy]

Originally Posted by LAJ

Dave is a helluva guy no question about it.

I guess it's just a matter of time before another show asks him to do a workshop at theirs.

like most things, there's no right or wrong way to shoot, and there are extremes on either end in how you conduct it.

i put dave way on the high end in terms of how he treats his models. honestly, he goes a lot further than is necessary.

but there are guys out there pissing in the model well too. i've seen shooting locations that *I* was uncomfortable walking around in, and i cant imagine a model getting naked in there. we've all heard stories of even well known producers who would do things like lure a girl out with a plane ticket, but then knowing she had no way to get herself back home basically make her do whatever they wanted. and let us not forget the old "you'll get paid when i get paid" business model.

i suspect most of the better well known shooters live somewhere in the middle but closer to dave than the other end by a long ways. heck, i'mt not a big time shooter, but we do provide NICE robes, some sort of fruit or veggie platter, water and sodas, and always a pristine shooting location.

however, i dont know ANYONE other than dave who will reserve a parking spot for a model.

[softball]

Originally Posted by Hell Puppy

like most things, there's no right or wrong way to shoot, and there are extremes on either end in how you conduct it.

i put dave way on the high end in terms of how he treats his models. honestly, he goes a lot further than is necessary.

but there are guys out there pissing in the model well too. i've seen shooting locations that *I* was uncomfortable walking around in, and i cant imagine a model getting naked in there. we've all heard stories of even well known producers who would do things like lure a girl out with a plane ticket, but then knowing she had no way to get herself back home basically make her do whatever they wanted. and let us not forget the old "you'll get paid when i get paid" business model.

i suspect most of the better well known shooters live somewhere in the middle but closer to dave than the other end by a long ways. heck, i'mt not a big time shooter, but we do provide NICE robes, some sort of fruit or veggie platter, water and sodas, and always a pristine shooting location.

however, i dont know ANYONE other than dave who will reserve a parking spot for a model.

I have to admit, that yesterday I paid a model's parking fee....10 bucks and blew all the profit. But I have a new revenue stream that I have found to be quite successful. I sell lube at 50 cents a squirt. So far it has increased the ROI on my shoots by 30 per cent.
Seriously, Dave is a little OTT, but it seems to work for him and I would rather see guys like Dave in the business than some of the shit I have seen going on around here.

[gonzo]

Originally Posted by rhetorical

I have to admit, that yesterday I paid a model's parking fee....10 bucks and blew all the profit. But I have a new revenue stream that I have found to be quite successful. I sell lube at 50 cents a squirt. So far it has increased the ROI on my shoots by 30 per cent.
Seriously, Dave is a little OTT, but it seems to work for him and I would rather see guys like Dave in the business than some of the shit I have seen going on around here.

Amen!
We joke about it and all I guess becasue it seems common sense to treat your model well but like it was said before there war way too many that will fly girls out with a one way ticket and make them work their way back out an for a place to stay.

Of course with the recent HIV information and AIM looking pretty irresponsibile , IMO fwere peple are going to be looking to shoot on the West Coast.

[Hell Puppy]

Like most things in this business, the thieves, scammers and guys looking to take the short cut for the quick buck, make it difficult on the rest of us.

Every credit card they burn is a customer removed from the pool. Same is true here for would be models and every girlie they talk to who might be considering shooting.

Best marketing you get in any business is your word of mouth.

[softball]

As some of you know, I have been in the entertainment business a very long time...longer than the internet. I learned very early on that talent makes you money and good talent makes you even more money. If you treat good talent well, you will profit. Ask any good film director.

[connor]

Originally Posted by RawAlex

Cybernetexpo appears (I haven't attended) to have turned the corner and made the shows more relevant again, getting people together and giving them the chances to interact. It appears to once again get the top people and the bottom together in one place, which allows things to happen.

Appreciate the comments... and yeah for sure, we're a different kind of show. The goal at Cybernet Expo is ALWAYS business first, ALWAYS to put people in the same room together throughout the course of the event, tp push learning new things and meeting new people and closing new deals. We're usually pretty successful at that, and I think we'll be even MORE successful this year. We'd love to get you out to SF... think about it as a last minute possibility. Advance registration ends this week.

There are of course way too many shows now. Used to be just IA2000 and Cybernet. But we can't help that so many other companies wanted to jump in there... all we can do is keep doing the show we know works for attendees and hope that common sense wins out in the end.

[softball]

I was in SF last year, first show ever, and did some serious business. We met someone who we have been working with for the past year to build a VOD site, which is just about ready to go. No mean feat for a small company. I credit the show for that and it was serious injection of capital into the pot.
I met some people I do business with and solidified my high opinion of them....Brad Mitchel of Mojohost comes to mind. I finally met Gonzo and HP which I think has been good for professional development...lol.
I met some people I currently do business with and I now maintain a more arm's length relationship with them and have formulated some plan b's just in case.
I also met some people that I thought I might do business with in the future, but having met them, pigs will fly before that happens.
All in all a great experience. Some nice dinners some good times and a learning experience and I love San Francisco anyway and the heat wave was a bonus.
Having said all that, there are still telephones, trains, planes, and automobiles that can be used to get around and do business outside shows, which I think people overlook. I have been doing some of that lately which is very productive.
Just an opinon of a porn trade show neophyte.