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Slavery is still rampant through out Africa, parts of the Middle East, and even in Eastern Europe now....
Amazing how these things can exist in modern times.....
Fuck Taco Hell....
Make a run for the border should become make a run to freedom! haha
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Same thing goes with Nike shoes. The workers are billeted in barracks style buildings on the property of the factory (whish is surrounded by high fences etc). The people are paid in Nike bucks for the most part, that can be spent only in the Nike compound. And the people need to apply for weekend passes to visit their family.
This happens in many many areas. Taco Bell and Nike are just 2 of the many many corporations out there cashing in on the poor.
I see nothing in this article that proves Taco Bell is using or even supporting slave labor. Their closest link is that the area of tomato farms in south florida is ONE of the MANY *areas* that Taco Bell gets its tomatoes from.
They cannot prove that Taco Bell uses any of the "slave labor" farms; they cannot even mention which farms these are. Nor do they make mention of any of the other hundreds of companies which buy tomatoes from this same area - just Taco Bell.
This is clearly an unsubstantiated slam piece on Taco Bell using coincedental theories with no facts whatsoever.
Saying that Taco Bell supports slave labor simply because it buys tomatoes from a particular county that allegedly harbors a few slave farms is a huge reach.
Give me facts, not conjecture.
And by the way, indentured servitude is not slavery; you don't see college students complaining when they get internships to Microsoft. Same thing.
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Originally posted by Mike AI@Nov 3 2003, 10:17 AM Slavery is still rampant through out Africa, parts of the Middle East, and even in Eastern Europe now....
Amazing how these things can exist in modern times.....
Fuck Taco Hell....
Make a run for the border should become make a run to freedom! haha
I don't mean to come off as callous here Mike, but
there are already enough people running to the
USA already. We are getting overpopulated and
I for one don't care to fork out my money to pay
for these illegals babies to be born here and pay
for all their other bullshit troubles they get into.
They should all take a stand for themselves in
their own countries, there are far more slaves
than owners, an uprising could easily occure and
change the way things are in that country for ever.
One would assume Carrie, that such a horrible accusation would be met with a slightly more aggressive attitude instead of just denying it.
I think its very naive to even consider this not a possibility considering I see groups os Mexicans on the side of the roads here willing to work under the same situations.
Maybe you dont see things like this around you, but some of us do.
Originally posted by voodooman+Nov 3 2003, 11:36 AM-->
QUOTE (voodooman @ Nov 3 2003, 11:36 AM)
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Originally posted by Bex@Nov 3 2003, 08:32 AM Same thing goes with Nike shoes. The workers are billeted in barracks style buildings on the property of the factory (whish is surrounded by high fences etc). The people are paid in Nike bucks for the most part, that can be spent only in the Nike compound. And the people need to apply for weekend passes to visit their family.
This happens in many many areas. Taco Bell and Nike are just 2 of the many many corporations out there cashing in on the poor.
Glad you brought this one up too.
I live in LA and can drive downtown and take you to Asian filled factories of little old ladies selling dresses for 25 cents each.
I can take you to another part of LA and show the same except its mexicans picking fruit and vegetables.
I happen to live in a state this is a high producer of produce (vegetables and fruits) as well as clothing, etc.
I see many immigrants working for change here.
Its a fact, and everyone in the US who eats salad, or buys an orange is reaping the benefits of modern slavery.
Fletch I can't just assume that Taco Bell is to blame (or contributing) simply because it purchases tomatoes from an area of a state that has "slave labor".
Give me a list of the farms that are doing this, then give me a list of the farms in that area that Taco Bell purchases tomatoes from.
If one of the farms shows up on both lists, *then* I'll believe it.
Until then, it's like saying that all porn surfers are pedophiles because there are a *few* porn sites that have underage girls on them.
A + B != C
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Originally posted by Carrie@Nov 3 2003, 08:44 AM Fletch I can't just assume that Taco Bell is to blame (or contributing) simply because it purchases tomatoes from an area of a state that has "slave labor".
Originally posted by Mike AI@Nov 3 2003, 08:41 AM We really should review our immigrqtion policies - but it will not happen due to political correctness - and thus we will continue to be overrun.
Hope everyone learns to speak Spanish soon!
Anyone see the new Leap Frog educational toy commercial?
It shows a little blond boy sitting on his front porch watching a Hispanic family move in. His mom hands him the new Leap Frog bi-lingual educational toy and in no time he has learned enough so he can go next door, say hello, tell the new kid his name and make a new friend!
While this all seems cute and edu-inspiring for most American families it sends a horrible message... why is it that WE need to learn THEIR language when they come HERE? Sure we're a melting pot... but immigrants from around the world learned English when they came here over the generations - why is it different this time around?
Living in Southern California I see so much of this happening. WE have to adapt. WE have to change. If not - WE lose out - not them. Take a look at the LA papers when ya'll come out for Webmaster Access at the end of the month and see how many jobs say "Bilingual Required" in the want ads. It's ridiculous.
I'll use the metric system if the rest of the world will speak English
As for the slave labor issues ...... I don't know
Obviously slavery isn't something we as a people can not tolerate but who defines what and what do we do
As for Taco Bell - nothing like being dru ... er intoxicated at 2:00AM and ordering one of everything - whatever you don't eat ends up ammo for a FOOD FIGHT
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Originally posted by kath@Nov 3 2003, 12:45 PM Anyone see the new Leap Frog educational toy commercial?
It shows a little blond boy sitting on his front porch watching a Hispanic family move in. His mom hands him the new Leap Frog bi-lingual educational toy and in no time he has learned enough so he can go next door, say hello, tell the new kid his name and make a new friend!
While this all seems cute and edu-inspiring for most American families it sends a horrible message... why is it that WE need to learn THEIR language when they come HERE? Sure we're a melting pot... but immigrants from around the world learned English when they came here over the generations - why is it different this time around?
Living in Southern California I see so much of this happening. WE have to adapt. WE have to change. If not - WE lose out - not them. Take a look at the LA papers when ya'll come out for Webmaster Access at the end of the month and see how many jobs say "Bilingual Required" in the want ads. It's ridiculous.
<_<
Can you imagine the outcry if they'd had it the other way with the Hispanic boy having to learn English??!!
Originally posted by Carrie@Nov 3 2003, 12:56 PM I realize that modern day slavery has long been accepted and commonplace with fancier names like "internships" and "apprenticeships".
Good point. My white, American born sister worked for a TV station for several months while doing her "internship' without a dime of pay and she had to cover her own gas and parking. I didn't see anyone running to HER defense.
Originally posted by kath@Nov 3 2003, 09:07 AM Anyone else thinking Burrito Supreme for lunch today? Chalupa with nacho cheese anyone? Geez... I haven't hit Taco Hell in ages!
I eat real mexican food
I rather hit any of the million local taco places for some real carne asada but not taco bell.
Fletch I don't recall any newspaper's job to be establishing guilt before innocence and placing the burden of proof on the accused.
Okay, so there are all of these little chinese women working in california selling dresses for a quarter, and mexicans in the hot sun picking vegetables for a quarter per bushel.
What do we do about it? *Should* we do anything about it?
Playing devil's advocate, there is something to be said for unskilled labor. Not everyone can be the CEO of a company and there is a place for "grunt workers". If these people are voluntarily and willingly doing these jobs, who are we to stop them?
If we actively enforced minimum wage laws and forced those businesses to pay those little chinese women $7 an hour, what would happen? I'd make a guess that the little chinese women would lose their jobs and have *no* income whatsoever.
I honestly can't see today's high school students being willing to get out in a field and pick anything, no matter the pay. Ewww! They'd get all dirty and smelly!
(Remember, devil's advocate - challenging the ideas, not you personally!)
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Originally posted by Peaches@Nov 3 2003, 08:57 AM Can you imagine the outcry if they'd had it the other way with the Hispanic boy having to learn English??!!
Originally posted by Carrie@Nov 3 2003, 09:10 AM Fletch I don't recall any newspaper's job to be establishing guilt before innocence and placing the burden of proof on the accused.
Okay, so there are all of these little chinese women working in california selling dresses for a quarter, and mexicans in the hot sun picking vegetables for a quarter per bushel.
What do we do about it? *Should* we do anything about it?
Playing devil's advocate, there is something to be said for unskilled labor. Not everyone can be the CEO of a company and there is a place for "grunt workers". If these people are voluntarily and willingly doing these jobs, who are we to stop them?
If we actively enforced minimum wage laws and forced those businesses to pay those little chinese women $7 an hour, what would happen? I'd make a guess that the little chinese women would lose their jobs and have *no* income whatsoever.
I honestly can't see today's high school students being willing to get out in a field and pick anything, no matter the pay. Ewww! They'd get all dirty and smelly!
(Remember, devil's advocate - challenging the ideas, not you personally!)
Its easy to sit on top of the hill and talk about the people down in the valley working hard.
Sure your high school kids wont go pick bananas in the sun, thats why there is a demand for it. Sure your undereducated white kids wont be able to be a CEO either. Most white kids in high school have no value for education anyhow.
I put a hard working man over a spoiled kid any day.
We have discussed this already havent we?
About Walmarts using a labor company that has been busted numerous times for illegals? People who shop at Walmart ( i dont there are none near me) and who eat Taco Bell of course wont complain about these things. Walmart support Chinese children labor with their 12 billion a year import, but of course its up to ME to prove that to you right?
So you can say we need them, (grunts and illegals) of course we do. But that doesnt make it right, and I am not here to prove the case either way.
Of course we need 'grunt workers' as you call them. That does not change the practice does it?
It must be nice to sit so many miles from everything and just cast them off as 'here say' and without proof.
Yeah im just some dumb white boy fighting for minorites.
If anything im just not BLIND like the rest of America.
Originally posted by Fletch XXX@Nov 3 2003, 12:19 PM Its easy to sit on top of the hill and talk about the people down in the valley working hard.
Sure your high school kids wont go pick bananas in the sun, thats why there is a demand for it. Sure your undereducated white kids wont be able to be a CEO either. Most white kids in high school have no value for education anyhow.
I put a hard working man over a spoiled kid any day.
We have discussed this already havent we?
About Walmarts using a labor company that has been busted numerous times for illegals? People who shop at Walmart ( i dont there are none near me) and who eat Taco Bell of course wont complain about these things. Walmart support Chinese children labor with their 12 billion a year import, but of course its up to ME to prove that to you right?
So you can say we need them, (grunts and illegals) of course we do. But that doesnt make it right, and I am not here to prove the case either way.
Of course we need 'grunt workers' as you call them. That does not change the practice does it?
It must be nice to sit so many miles from everything and just cast them off as 'here say' and without proof.
Yeah im just some dumb white boy fighting for minorites.
If anything im just not BLIND like the rest of America.
See, this is why you and I bang heads.
I challenged the situation and asked questions; you ignored the questions and tried to insult me personally for asking them. I am NOT sitting on my high horse denying they exist, quit trying to make me out as some elitist sitting here with a silver spoon in my mouth who has never even seen an immigrant. You brought up the problem, I'm asking you what you think the solution is or should be.
Let me try again...
What should we do about little chinese women selling dresses for a quarter and mexicans picking vegetables for change?
What's your solution?
Pay them minimum wage? Deport them? Legalize them and let them apply for unemployment and welfare? Or something else...?
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PS - I'd rather have a hard-working man over a spoiled kid any day as well. When I was down in Florida I'd frequently hire a man with *no* computer skills over a prissy paper tech who bragged about how he'd just passed his MCSE test.
The man with no computer skills wanted to learn and was willing to work, the paper techs just wanted to be paid for the certificate they were holding without having to work at all.
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Originally posted by Carrie@Nov 3 2003, 12:48 PM PS - I'd rather have a hard-working man over a spoiled kid any day as well. When I was down in Florida I'd frequently hire a man with *no* computer skills over a prissy paper tech who bragged about how he'd just passed his MCSE test.
The man with no computer skills wanted to learn and was willing to work, the paper techs just wanted to be paid for the certificate they were holding without having to work at all.
MSCE what a fucking JOKE!
Just like the CNE I used to work with. Back in them days if you got him out of folio he wanted to know what to do at the command prompt!
I told him to call Marshall Maghee and get a copy of Automenu.
I wipe my ass with certifications. 90% of em couldnt plug in a network card or put an end on a piece of coax for arcnet.
And now when you take a class and a certification test for Microsoft they tell you...well this is the way it really wroks but heres how you have to answer for the test. I call BULLSHIT!!!
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To all sponsors, linklists, TGPs that I do or shall do business with... I demand that you prove to me that you are not doing business with any company that does business with Acacia.......
To all emaillist providers that I do or shall do business with... Prove to me that you have never supported SPAM....
and
Have you stopped beating your wife ?????
What do all these have in common, they are all Lose-Lose propositions....
The sponsors, linklists, Tgps and emaillist providers can not possibly prove what I have asked them to prove....
and Taco Bell is in basically the same position....
It's a lose-lose situation for Taco Bell....
They are being asked to prove that they do not use ingredients that were produced by slave labor....
At the same time, no article that I can find names who the "slave labor" growers are..... If the people making the accusations of "slave labor" can not name who is actually doing it, how do they expect Taco Bell to be able to do it...
Taco Bell can demand from their growers that they state that they are not using slave labor.. Will this mean that they aren't using it ?? No.. It will only mean that they signed a statement saying they don't use it...
Slave labor is against the law in the United States.... If a company is running a legitimate company within the United States, you have to assume, until proven otherwise, that they are operating legally... Taco Bell is a BIG buyer of Tomatoes, I am sure that, just like any company must, they buy on a competitive market at the lowest price that they can get... If they are buying in the US, a product produced in the US, they must assume that that product was produced legally... Any other assumption can lead to charges by producers, against Taco Bell, of favoritism etc.....
If you put someone in a lose-lose situation, one thing is sure, they will lose....
Taco Bell has not anwered the charges levelled against them.... If I were them, I wouldn't either......... No matter how they answer them, they lose.....
Gonzo I hear ya. The paper techs couldn't believe that the job would actually involve working outside without air conditioning (gasp), or going into people's homes (eww) and opening up their computers. Most of them had never even cracked a case. They didn't know a mac address from a Macintosh and couldn't even set up email accounts in Outlook Express. They wanted to be at work at 9 and leave before 5 - working only in the office telling the DSL technicians what to do, of course.
The older guys coming would say "Look, all I've done is surfed around on the internet. I don't have any degrees but I promise you if you show me how to do it, I'll learn it." They were there every morning at 7:30 and they insisted on staying at the site until the problem was fixed, even if that meant going home at 10pm. Didn't matter if I wanted to send them down to Homestead or up to Jupiter, they were happy to go. The paper techs refused to drive their shiny cars into Miami because they might get carjacked and whined anytime I tried to send them further than Deerfield Beach. (This is from central Ft Lauderdale.)
It was pathetic.
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Originally posted by Carrie@Nov 3 2003, 10:21 AM Gonzo I hear ya. The paper techs couldn't believe that the job would actually involve working outside without air conditioning (gasp), or going into people's homes (eww) and opening up their computers. Most of them had never even cracked a case. They didn't know a mac address from a Macintosh and couldn't even set up email accounts in Outlook Express. They wanted to be at work at 9 and leave before 5 - working only in the office telling the DSL technicians what to do, of course.
The older guys coming would say "Look, all I've done is surfed around on the internet. I don't have any degrees but I promise you if you show me how to do it, I'll learn it." They were there every morning at 7:30 and they insisted on staying at the site until the problem was fixed, even if that meant going home at 10pm. Didn't matter if I wanted to send them down to Homestead or up to Jupiter, they were happy to go. The paper techs refused to drive their shiny cars into Miami because they might get carjacked and whined anytime I tried to send them further than Deerfield Beach. (This is from central Ft Lauderdale.)
It was pathetic.
Mmmm.. tacos.
I wish Soviet finland would have taco bells. I'm forced to eat raw salmon and herring year around. Damn.
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OK, I don't know about all you big city folks, but having visited Texas a few times, and enjoying the Mexican food or Texicali I can say one thing so certain.
Taco Bell food (at least in oHIo) SUCKS!!
and not in that warm wet way either
Originally posted by spazlabz@Nov 3 2003, 02:32 PM OK, I don't know about all you big city folks, but having visited Texas a few times, and enjoying the Mexican food or Texicali I can say one thing so certain.
Taco Bell food (at least in oHIo) SUCKS!!
and not in that warm wet way either
spaz
We have several small REAL Mexican places around here (there's a huge market for Mexican manual labor). Personally, I like the Americanized larger Mexican restaurants and Taco Bell. Perhaps not being able to cook makes me appreciate eating edible crappy food.
Originally posted by Fletch XXX@Nov 3 2003, 08:37 AM One would assume Carrie, that such a horrible accusation would be met with a slightly more aggressive attitude instead of just denying it.
I think its very naive to even consider this not a possibility considering I see groups os Mexicans on the side of the roads here willing to work under the same situations.
Maybe you dont see things like this around you, but some of us do.
give me a break . . . you think the migrant workers you see are not getting paid? I don't recall seeing any fences, or armed guards.
Does the name Cesar Chavez ring any bells with you?
I can understand why Pepsico (I believe the parent company of Taco Bell) would not bother being drawn into this bullshit by responding.
Originally posted by Peaches@Nov 3 2003, 08:57 AM Can you imagine the outcry if they'd had it the other way with the Hispanic boy having to learn English??!!
ummm, they do, as soon as they step inside the classroom
Originally posted by TeenGodFather@Nov 3 2003, 10:27 AM Mmmm.. tacos.
I wish Soviet finland would have taco bells. I'm forced to eat raw salmon and herring year around. Damn.
fish tacos are good . . . . what is the matter? can't fold a corn tortilla in half?
Originally posted by baddog@Nov 3 2003, 07:39 PM I can understand why Pepsico (I believe the parent company of Taco Bell) would not bother being drawn into this bullshit by responding.
HeyBD....
Pepsi has not owned Taco Bell for a while, at least not directly....
They were spun off along with KFC and Pizza Hut to form YUM co.
PEPSICO APPROVES SPINOFF PLAN WITH ONE-TIME $4.5 BILLION DISTRIBUTION; QUARTERLY DIVIDEND ALSO DECLARED
PURCHASE, N.Y. (August 14, 1997) -- PepsiCo, Inc., announced today that its Board of Directors approved a formal plan to spin off to shareholders the corporation’s restaurant business.
The Board’s action authorizes PepsiCo to proceed with plans disclosed in January to spin off the restaurant business.
PepsiCo’s restaurant business, with about $10 billion in annual revenues, includes the global Pizza Hut, KFC and Taco Bell brands. Its packaged goods business consists of Pepsi-Cola Company and Frito-Lay Company, which generate some $20 billion in annual revenues.
Under terms of the plan, the separation of the packaged goods and restaurant businesses will occur at the end of the day on October 6, 1997. Shareholders of record on September 19, 1997 will receive one share in the new restaurant company, Tricon Global Restaurants, Inc., for every 10 shares of stock they hold in PepsiCo, Inc.
The plan approved by the Board calls for Tricon to enter into separate financing arrangements and to pay PepsiCo a one-time distribution of $4.5 billion at the time of the spin off. PepsiCo intends to use the money to pay down debt and repurchase shares.
Originally posted by sarettah@Nov 3 2003, 05:02 PM
HeyBD....
Pepsi has not owned Taco Bell for a while, at least not directly....
They were spun off along with KFC and Pizza Hut to form YUM co.
uh, okay . . . fill in the blank then, I stand by my earlier comment. There is nothing to be gained by getting drawn in by some b.s organization accusing them of supporting slave labor camps.
Damn . . . .I am never going to get used to the fact that I can't hit Alt-S to send here
not to get off topic... but my friend wanted me to ask a question... if someone happened to be in the market for one of these "slaves" where would one go about looking? what might one cost? what about delivery? can they be shipped UPS/DHL etc or do you need to go to the slave place and actually pick them up? anyone?
Originally posted by JR@Nov 3 2003, 08:58 PM not to get off topic... but my friend wanted me to ask a question... if someone happened to be in the market for one of these "slaves" where would one go about looking? what might one cost? what about delivery? can they be shipped UPS/DHL etc or do you need to go to the slave place and actually pick them up? anyone?
You can usually pick one up in front of the Home Depot any morning before 8:00 if you want a good one
11-03-2003
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