Max Hardcore found guilty on all charges

[Jace]

http://www2.tbo.com/content/2008/jun...eciding-verdi/

[Toby]

Now the judge has to rule on the dismissal motion that she deferred on the other day, hoping the jury would make the decision moot.

It would not surprise me if she tosses all the charges related to the videos shipped by Jaded.

[RawAlex]

Toby, while I think you may be correct, I think that the key charged in this are the obscenity and not the shipping. 99% of us know better than to ship porn to certain zip codes, and that is that. But the concern is that these same zipcodes may also be "no go" zones for internet as well, which would require some sort of system for determining if a user is in a "bad" zip code.

I also think the judge will do the same. When that happens, the appeal is automatic because the other charges were apparently triggered mostly as a result of the videos received by mail.

[Toby]

The Miller Test is woefully outdated and at some point a case will get brought before the Supreme Court. I'm just not sure this is the case or the time for that.

[tony404]

Originally Posted by Toby

The Miller Test is woefully outdated and at some point a case will get brought before the Supreme Court. I'm just not sure this is the case or the time for that.

Not the current supreme court. lol

[RawAlex]

At some point, I hope that Max doesn't become a test case, because his material is "out there" and certainly beyond what 90% of the porn world is doing. I am hardened by years and years of porn and I still cringe when I see his stuff. I am sure it wasn't hard for at least half that jury to find the material obscene just like that.

Like I said, I hope the judge tosses out most of it (related to the interstate sale by mail) and leaves the defense a big hole to claim everything else was bootstrapped off that initial act (which at worst would be charges against the distributor).

[Toby]

I just read a more detailed article on AVN.

"After the jury returned its verdict, the judge dismissed the defense's motion to dismiss the case which had been held in reserve."

Sentencing should be interesting.

[Forest]

umm maybe i read the article wrong but he was found guilty on 10 of the 20 charges

how is that found guilty on all charges?

[Toby]

That article doesn't explain very well. The jury returned guilty on all 20 counts. 10 against Max himself and 10 against Max World Entertainment.

Based on some of the juror comments afterwards it appears they were initially hung on the 10 charges regarding transportation of obscene material via the internet (5 against each), but after taking a break they finally returned a verdict on all 20 charges

http://www.avn.com/video/articles/30610.html

[Forest]

Originally Posted by Toby

That article doesn't explain very well. The jury returned guilty on all 20 counts. 10 against Max himself and 10 against Max World Entertainment.

Based on some of the juror comments afterwards it appears they were initially hung on the 10 charges regarding transportation of obscene material via the internet (5 against each), but after taking a break they finally returned a verdict on all 20 charges

http://www.avn.com/video/articles/30610.html

"There are people on both sides of the issues and we do not believe we will be able to make a decision on the 20 counts. How long must we deliberate? We are fairly certain we will not be able to reach a decision. This applies to 10 of the 20 counts."

That says to me they were Not able to make a decision on all 20 counts.

[Toby]

Originally Posted by Forest

"There are people on both sides of the issues and we do not believe we will be able to make a decision on the 20 counts. How long must we deliberate? We are fairly certain we will not be able to reach a decision. This applies to 10 of the 20 counts."

That says to me they were Not able to make a decision on all 20 counts.

Keep reading, that was in a question to the judge at 3 PM. The judge urged them to try again and the jury took a break then went back to deliberate more. They returned a guilty verdict on all counts at around 7 PM.

[RawAlex]

I am suspecting the 10 they had a problem with were the internet related ones.

[Paul Markham]

Take out the "porn for profit" element and imagine this was a guy abusing a girl he paid money to for kicks. Should that be legal under the "Freedom of Speech rights?

Paul Little got what he deserved. Maybe the jury considered the porn element not obscene and the assault issue was obscene.

[Jace]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Take out the "porn for profit" element and imagine this was a guy abusing a girl he paid money to for kicks. Should that be legal under the "Freedom of Speech rights?

Paul Little got what he deserved. Maybe the jury considered the porn element not obscene and the assault issue was obscene.

sorry, but can you show me the assault charge?

i know max personally, and I know people that perform in his videos personally, I can tell you first hand there is no abuse and every girl knows EXACTLY what she is getting herself into

I don't like it, i think it is disgusting and someone should castrate him, but I also don't think some judge in tampa florida should be able to tell me what I can and can't watch

[EmporerEJ]

Originally Posted by Jace

sorry, but can you show me the assault charge?

i know max personally, and I know people that perform in his videos personally, I can tell you first hand there is no abuse and every girl knows EXACTLY what she is getting herself into

I don't like it, i think it is disgusting and someone should castrate him, but I also don't think some judge in tampa florida should be able to tell me what I can and can't watch

I'll do you one better....Max usually has the girl identify herself in the video, and make the statement that she is doing it of her free will.

The "icing" on this, is, not one witness to say otherwise. The argument is moot.

[Hell Puppy]

That canary is dead.

Stay out of that shaft.

[RawAlex]

Jace, we have a similar problem in Canada - you don't have to abuse someone to give the impression of abuse, which is where many people (including the Sweets) run into problems. No matter what the girl says she agreed to, no matter how many times she repeats it on camera, etc... most people don't see the disclaimer, they just see the act.

Some of Max's stuff is over the top even from the point of view of someone who's sensitivity has been dulled by 25 years of porn.

I understand the idea that freedom of speech is suppose to mean that all speech is free, but the reality is that a sane society does put some limits on things (FIRE!), and often that limit is set by a majority rather than a unanimous vote or agreement. A very small percentage of the world wants to see a girl puke on Max's cock, the rest of us can live without it, our lives are not diminished because we can't see girls gagging on his cock. Further, if Max made those movies only for his own enjoyment or gave them away for free online (newsgroups) it is unlikely that anything would have happened. Apparently commercial speech has a higher standard to live up to.

In between what a past AG refered to as "protected speech" and Max Hardcore there is a ton of space for all of us to enjoy ourselves, to make a good living, and to keep doing what we do.