there would not be a 157 page indictment called "The United States of America vs Usama bin Laden" if the US Government did not feel they had enough evidence to convict him.

that is what is fucked about all of this.

they ALREADY had enough evidence.
http://www.fbi.gov/majcases/eastafrica/indictment.pdf

so much for the legal process and "bringing them to justice"

as i said before, "justice" can only be found in eliminating the threat and protecting humanity from future attacks. Not jailing a whacked out asshole who wanted to die anyway.


justreading

Serge,

I am sure Powell is correct, the evidence I hear is mounting every day!!!

Hi JR, long time no see
sextoyking 30% commissions on all sextoy sales!

i agree, whether bin laden did it or not he needs to be taken out. a message needs to be sent to these assholes all around the world - that they are now being taken seriously and alot of resources will be invested to clear the scum up.

i think it would be wrong to just level middle east nations when the fight is against the terrorists but in say that - i agree with bush you are either with us or you are not.

General (What's NEW?) $100 per converted member - Everyday !

Emi just told me she heard Colin Powell saying we have ENOUGH evidence to convict Bin Laden in court....

glad you enjoyed France,
and as for russian menues,
Turkey has them too, russians DO travel alot now.
Serge

how was your Euro trip? are you back "home"
__________

Paris and France was great. Very beautiful and my opinion was that people there were quite nice and polite.

Every restaurant i ate in, in Paris had menus in Russian. That was quite a surprise.

i was in Paris when all this happened. The reaction all over Europe was the same. The shock and outrage was the same.

my mobile phone rang for two days non-stop with people expressing their sentiments.
_______________________________

we have only CIRCUMSTANTIAL evidence against Bin Laden.
______________________________

i think it is irrelevant. this is not about revenge. this is about terrorism. the fact that he is a terrorist and his organization is a terrorist organization is not circumstantial.

read the FBI indictment. very interesting reading.

fuck him. fuck a court of law. i say time to make him a "Martyr"

There will always be terrorists. BUT terrorists need money, training, weapons, a place to hide when they train, documents etc, etc, etc.

A bigger point here is to positively turn the world against terrorism.

justreading

Dean,
is that you on ebay?? :)))


sextoyking 30% commissions on all sextoy sales!

one problem I see, though....

from what I see,
we have only CIRCUMSTANTIAL evidence against Bin Laden.

If Taliban gives him up, can we convict him in OUR court of law, where OJ is "not guilty" by one court and guilty by another?

I was affraid they would do give him away and ANOTHER ter act goes up while he is in custody just to prove his "non involvement"

how can one PROVE in the court of law that one gave order when the one who got the order is already dead?

if Taliban gives him away,
we won't be able to do anything in Afganistan and Stalin proved that world doesn't need Lenins to carry away his teachings.
Bin Laden can be replaced easier than the whole terrorist network we are after.
Serge

i did not realize how long that was.
justreading
****************

I read EVERY word. Something I don't do with bullshit mile long e-mail postings
;-)))

JR,
how was your Euro trip? are you back "home"?
Serge

JR, Nick,
I agree on all points,
glad to see there are guys out there who UNDERSTAND the world dynamics.

yeap,
JR nailed it:
"there is no middle ground. there is no negotiation. just those simple two choices.

survival or death."

I spoke with my son whose friends in school lost BOTH parents in WTC.

what all those heart bleeding liberals gonna say to those kids?

we MUST protect OUR children first,
and it's a VERY clear choice for me.
Serge

HOLY SHIT!!

sorry about that. i did not realize how long that was.
justreading

Serge, i agree with you. He distorted information a little to help make his points.

he left out the simple fact that it is a well coordinated and INTERNATIONAL action, led by the US, that is backed by a UN resolution and enjoys the support of the entire free world. A minor detail which more or less negates the article. It has less to do with retaliation by the US, than it does to finally begin to erradicate a disease which now threatens us all indescriminately.

that does not apply to any of the examples he uses to support his arguement.

While Usama bin Laden is counting on retaliation to gather support for his "cause" in the Muslim world. Most of the Muslim world has sided against him. the only support he has are by people that are largely unaware of what is happening... do not have TV's, free access to press or money to buy bread.

Usama bin Laden has publically declared war against the US many years ago. He/his organization is directly connected to numerous terrorist attacks against the US... including many planned attacks which never materialized after being thwarted.

this whole issue is not a question of revenge as much as it is a question of defending civilization against people who want to see all of us dead, simply because we are "infedels" and deserve to die.

are the hows and whys as important right now as what needs to be done? They (terrorists/terrorism) killed more than six thousand people. As Tony Blair stated, this number of deaths is only limited due to technical factors, not objectives or planning. If they could kill us all right now, they would.

they would kill every man, woman and child that does not agree with them if it was technically possible. They even indescriminately kill themselves and each other because they feel it is an honor and believe they will be rewarded in the "after life"

Their logic (according to the FBI 157 page indictment against Usama bin Laden) is very simple. They kill. They kill indescriminately. Their goal is to inflict as much damage, death, pain and suffering as possible against the enemy. Who is the enemy? Anyone that does not share their extreme interpretation of their religion.

what about the Muslims they kill in the process? Simple. "if they are good Muslims, they go to "paradise", if they are bad muslims, or non believers... they deserved to die anyway"...... so either way, in their view they just did the world a favor by causing as many casualties as possible.

these people have grown in the last two decades in sophistication (exponentially), numbers and political and financial support. .. and i am horrified to think about their increasing ability to launch a biological/chemical weapons attack, or even detonate a nuclear device in a densly populated city.

As that article misstated, he did not win anything in Afghanistan by being a hero, a warrior and a great military tactition. They backed Russia out of Afghanistan with things like VERY effective Stinger anti aircraft missiles supplied directly by the US which quickly turned the tides. They were trained in US sponsored training camps in Afghanistan, many of which are now thought now to be terrrorist training camps.

these people were trained, sponsored and supplied by Western Governments to achieve political ends during the Cold War. Now after centuries of war, death and hearts filled with nothing but hatred and dispair, they have found a new enemy. the same enemy that help to create them. the same enemy that showed them how to fight and kill effectively.

without an enemy, these people cannot exist.

This enemy is now the civilized world. That enemy is you. that enemy is your child, your wife, your parents, your friends. that enemy is everyone who does not share what even the entire Muslim world agrees is an incredibly bizzare interpretation of a religion that largely espouses peace and love.

we are negotiating with the PLO which is a known terrorist organization.

London negotiates non-stop with IRA

etc etc etc.

terrorism exists because we as a civilization have allowed it to exist. In the above cases, it has even gained the much sought after respect of the perpetrators. It has proven in the end to be an effective negotiation tool.

to date, as a civilization, we have even allowed it to see effective results.
that is the greatest tragedy in all of this. In this sense, humanity has failed itself and created and fed this monster.

now it is just a disease and it is growing. it is now more lethal and destructive than it ever has been and in some poverty and war torn parts of the world, it is highly contageous and needs to be stopped.

it is now a simple question of freedom versus death for every citizen of the free world. that is how they have ALWAYS seen it. that is how we now need to see it.

there is no middle ground. there is no negotiation. just those simple two choices.

survival or death.

everyone needs to look at what happened in New York, then look into the eyes of their friends, their family, their children, their spouse and their fellow citizens and decide what that choice is.

to me, there is one answer.

To date, i am confident in everything is have seen, heard and read by the US Government, EU Governments and the international community to make the right decision.

like the people who are against us... i also feel this is a cause worth dying for. I would much rather see a highly trained soldier die fighting this problem, than a woman while clutching her baby as her office building collapses, killing thousands.

I have the deepest respect for those who are on their way their right now to take the first steps to begin to erradicate this plague.

my heart is with them as are my thoughts and i wish them luck.


justreading

""without ability to look in the mirror and see what I liked....""

Spot on!

A coward dies a thousand deaths,a brave man only one.
:)
Nick

Serge,
You misunderstand me,I agree wholeheartedly.I mask emotion with humour (I think its a brit thing;)

I truly believe:

1.)We cannot have media coverage of a win-at-all-costs-war.(Which is what it must be)
2.)US must maintain this anger and resolve and not let it fade.
3.)US must understand that with position (No1 force in the world) comes responsibility.That responsibility is,like it or not,to be the world's peacekeeper.

Its isolationist position and toe dipping in world affairs must stop.

These attacks have exposed the fact that the US is not protected by a strip of water (As Britain thought prior to WWII)and its laissez-faire attitude to world politics must change.I mean,FDR had to ignore warnings of Pearl in order to ensure the US's entry into WWII.

For the record btw I love the US,why?Its population had the best "filtered traffic" ever.ie the population consists mainly of people or descendents of people who had the balls to leave the safety of "home" for the chance to taste freedom,some wonder why it became the greatest nation?I don't.

Perhaps relinquishing some rights and freedoms may be merely a pothole on the highway to peace.

(end rant;)
Nick

glad you are safe my friend :)
********************************

I felt safer in Turkey,
but this is NOT about MY safety,
I'd rather share the fate of my country and be here than
hide for the rest of my life
without ability to look in the mirror and see what I liked....
Serge

Nick,
I am NOT politically correct, far from it, even though YOU cna give me a few lessons
;-)

Abandoning our imperfect friends as Saudies, egyptians, israeli
will NOT help free world,
will NOT assure our safety and way of life
ERADICATING the swamp that breeds malaria moscitos will.


Serge

I reckon all fanatics should be put up against a wall and shot!;)

Just watched "Politically Incorrect".I reckon they have been reading this board.;)

Btw welcome home Serge,glad you are safe my friend :)

Gnite :)
Nick

http://www.smh.com.au/news/0109/22/world/world7.html
*************************

well,
this guy is exploring marxist-lenin
premise that all wars in this world can be explained by "war between classes"
rich against poor
(like Dig's efforts to fight with Oprano)
;-)))

his recepie for success is:
redistribution of wealth

he clearly fails to see that it didn't stop Soviet Union from it's expansionism policies,
RADICAL ISLAM won't stop with overthrowing Saudi's Egypt and other friendly regimes,
they, as ALL fundamentalists do,
want
"the world"

Marty,
I never won any UN press awards like the other guy,
but I see clear through his bullshit and idea that bancrupt ideology of marx and lenin would prevail today.

It only will be a trap if we fight with one hand behind the back,
like Israel does in the name of
"world opinion".....

Disassembling Taliban as political entity will send message to ALL governments out there:
Fight them on your own or see your governments and countries bombed out of existence.

TODAY the civilized world has capacity to fight them,
it will be tougher fight than the one we had 10 years ago with Papa Bush as a leader,
but...10 years from now the fight will be even tougher if the situation left unchecked.

Will we have retaliation for our military actions?
most definatelly.
Will our actions today save lives of people 10 years from now?
I HOPE so.
Serge

one last day to bid on it.. first celebrity site on the net..
tony z. xpix.com going going gone..

How much will xpix.com sell for on ebay?
tony z. XPiX.com auction on ebay

hey vick

how are you going ! its been along time.

sykkboy - where can i take a look at that software ?



General (What's NEW?) $100 per converted member - Everyday !

Vick..

that Sydney Morning Herald article
was written by Robert Fisk, a highly-
regarded independent journalist who won:

- Amnesty Int. Overall Media Award 1998
- British Int. Journalist of the Year Award (7 times)
- United Nations Press Award 1986
- Johns Hopkins prize for int. journalism 1996

just because his (or other) views do NOT reflect an
'unquestioning jingoistic blind charge into battle'
doesn't mean that they're either
'propaganda and bullshit' as you say,
or that they're unpatriotic or anti-american.

that said, welcome to WW3!





Marty

Vick, yup, not real bright...

to think they could have bought our casino/race and sports book software for $100K hehehehehe, we might have even installed it for free....lol

but one thing about it, with bigger companies at least paving the way for USa-owned cybercasinos, maybe us smalleer guys can hit the niches and make a few $$$ without going through the red tape these guys with the money and lawyers can clear up...
SykkBoy

Sykk
you know what is sick about that article?

"He said he expected the company to spend about $10 million to $30 million to make the site operational. "

"MGM Mirage expects to hire about 100 people to operate the site"

Are they trying to emulate mainstream dot com's?

The casinos are missing out on the biggest simple $ maker ......

It's right under their noses

Vick Soon, Very Soon

http://www.lvrj.com/lvrj_home/2001/Sep-21-Fri-2001/business/17049553.html

hmm, does this mean us little guys may one day have a chance to open an online casino? probably not...hehehe, but interesting how a year ago, they were arresting people, now one of the majors opens one...sorry to change the current subject...just found it interesting...
SykkBoy

http://www.smh.com.au/news/0109/22/world/world7.html

Is propaganda and bullshit aimed at weakening American resolve
We have no choice, if we do not stop terrorists they will continue to attack
This is not a war of retaliation
It is an act of self preservation

Vick It's coming

agreed mikeai - and the act of deciding who is 'extremist' is also a 'subjective' interpretation ... we can agree to blow up all extremists, but how many of us could agree on what qualifies!!!

bush and his team have a lot of lives and futures in their hands :-(
_____________

Indeed CJ - and I have tremendous faith in Bush and his team - Cheney, Powell, Rumsfield, Rice, et al.


Mike AI Football pickem gearing back up - can anyone beat KK???

agreed mikeai - and the act of deciding who is 'extremist' is also a 'subjective' interpretation ... we can agree to blow up all extremists, but how many of us could agree on what qualifies!!!

bush and his team have a lot of lives and futures in their hands :-(

serge, its great to have you back safe :-)

cj (nipple pink 'vaginator') $70 per FREE signup!!

Worth reading for another angle on things.....

http://www.smh.com.au/news/0109/22/world/world7.html
Marty

Serge we are eye to eye... defaintely good to have you back!



Mike AI Football pickem gearing back up - can anyone beat KK???

ok,
i've been on my feet 34 hours straight, time for bed...

guys, it's good to be back home!
Serge

CJ there is no reason to wipe out crazies, or "extremeists" - only those who are capable of doing damage to the USA. We have all kinds of kooks who live in the good old USA and besides David Koresh and his followers who the justice department set on fire - we live and let live.

Same applies internationally - but once the extremeism becomes a nation security threat to the USA - we MUST be PROACTIVE.


Mike AI Football pickem gearing back up - can anyone beat KK???

cj, yes, Bible, Koran, Torah, are very good and wise books, it's all in the interpretation and WHO interprets it.....
Serge

BTW, few things which caught my attention on CNN last week:

1) Jerry Fallwell's explanation that the terrorist attack was caused by.....gays and lesbians
what a fucking MORON! who would devide the country on his death bed!

2) Billy Grahm, who reads the same Bible, BTW and his message UNITING people of all faith

3) President's Bush face in Tampa when he learned about the second plane hit on Pentagon...I wonder if you guys saw this footage,
he was reading something to school kids in class room when somebody whispered something in his ear and how his face expression changed when it sank into his mind....
very powerful and interesting stuff.
Serge

The entire Islamic Fundemantalist movement started in the 70s - with the Iytollah of Iran when he spread his message through cassete tapes - first he seized Iran, and now we are reaping what he sowed. and it WAS Ideas....
-----

this is simply one group of extremists, raised out of many centuries of religious differences - if that whole generation is wiped out and all of their followers, how long before the next extremist group? what was the extremist group before that?

quoting dogma :-)
the ideas aren't always the problem, its those who turn the idea into a belief structure and live their lives devoted to that single 'idea' that cause 'terrorism' and all other shit like this.

cj (nipple pink 'vaginator') $70 per FREE signup!!

Talking about Ayatollah and what I learned in Turkey

there are 2 huge Islamic teachings:

1) suni who believe that Koran is The book and it's teachings are paramount.
Turks are mostly sunies.

2) Shiits who believe that Koran is open for interpretation by current leaders like Ayatolla Khomeini, current Afgani clerics,
that IS dangerous, as everybody read the same Koran which is objective and the way they interprit it is SUBJECTIVE.

it's like one reads the Bible and gets the message of LOVE out of it and another creates Inqusition...all from reading the SAME book.
Serge

Well that artist thing wasnt to bad....could have been better without the Crack Head Neil Young;))...reminds be of my own years in the ozone;))


BTW your right ....that was me in the new Puffy video returning his golf ball ...work it up;)))
JohnInternetPimp

serge....those things you mentioned do not violate my civil liberties, so i would have 0 problem with them

Mike...Ideas are the root of everything, this country was founded on the idea that people could live without extreme taxation andopression...

wait a minute..hmmmm:)
grimm Xingster

Alien,
I was living on the other side of the fence, believe me,
lack of civilt liberties is NOT panacea from all ills and not the true answer, but....
there is ALWAYS a delicate balance and I believe
IT CAN BE ACHIEVED.

but STATUS quo is NOT working, and terrorists proved it to us all....
Serge

Lenin did that
Hitler did that
bin Laden does that...
WORDS ARE MORE DANGEROUS THAN NUKES.

____________

The entire Islamic Fundemantalist movement started in the 70s - with the Iytollah of Iran when he spread his message through cassete tapes - first he seized Iran, and now we are reaping what he sowed. and it WAS Ideas....


I saw the people on CNN as well Serge, it makes me sick as well - ignorant, spoiled children who are dissconected from their wealthy parents and who would not know how to survive in the real world!


Mike AI Football pickem gearing back up - can anyone beat KK???

CIA is not exactly dead,
I believe we'll have the information in time,

---

i liked your point earlier where you said you would prefer not to hear on cnn as that means they hear too...

let's hope the silence and lack of confirmation of solid info is a sign that the cia is SEALED TIGHT and cnn is NOT getting that info. I too am happy not to know anything if its means *they* don't either ...

cj (nipple pink 'vaginator') $70 per FREE signup!!

Welcome back Serge, nice discussion of our Civil Liberties being redressed in the name of protection.

You got nothing to fear if you got nothing to hide.

Live like an American should and buy your self a hand gun or rifle.

My M21 rifle is now being custom built.
ALIEN Welcome back Serge

Grimm, agree.

cj,
we fought sucessfuly Communism, which has basically the same goals as fundamental Islam.

CIA is not exactly dead,
I believe we'll have the information in time,
and if Afganistan is just a begining and show of our resolve-
WE'LL WIN,
even though the price will be high.
Serge

as an aside for the feds who may or may not be monitoring this board, I love America, see, I'm waving my flag I bought at the Walmart store...I just happen to have a little bit of chemistry knowledge...

isn't it kind of odd how many people are "discovering patriotism" but only as a passing fad...I saw an intersting tussel at the store today, a few people arguing over which flag was trendier..one sewn onto a jacket or one on a pole that could be waved around or mounted to a car...
SykkBoy

I for one, am not ready to give up my civil liberties to live a life of poverty, and opression, no matter how "safe" it makes me:)


grimm
*************

Grimm, this is bull in purest form and you know it!

I didn't become more poor due to being checked 8 times at airport today.

you won't get poor if your ID will have your DNA strain in it which can be easily scanned and checked against d/b every time one stops you....Saudi Arabia is VERY rich country, despite the fact that they don't know what civil liberties are...
Serge

Call me names, but I don't believe for a second that the best arms wins....
the best RESOLVE wins,
-------

Its always best resolve that wins anything over force ... in this situation, the 'enemy' (as soon as we identify them ALL!) are more than prepared to fight for their beliefs where their resolve runs deep - is America's resolve as strong or are there too many doubts as to just how many enemy's will have to be destroyed ...
its hard to have 'resolve' when the battle you are fighting is unclear - cnn helps greatly with that :-))))


cj (nipple pink 'vaginator') $70 per FREE signup!!

Serge, words may be deadlier.

Ideas are the beginning of everything, when distorted they can become dangerous, but the converse is true too...


but words are not the problem, men are the problem, without men, words are just well, words:)

grimm Xingster

Vick,
imagine if we had Iraq in addition to Turkey and Israel on middle east now?
Serge

serge..the beauty of this country
**********************************

Grimm,
and I'll do everything I can to make sure that those who deface the beauty have less capabilities to do so.

As for "you have the right to say what you feel"
1) not really
2) sometimes, as we all know, the words are mightier than the sword.

EVERYTHING begins with words and formulation of IDEA.

Lenin did that
Hitler did that
bin Laden does that...
WORDS ARE MORE DANGEROUS THAN NUKES.
Serge

====================================
I heard the guy on CNN who can create chemical weapons with one soviet chemist and $100,000 worth of common chemicals,
something one can't do to create a nuke device.
====================================

exactly, uranium isn't exactly the easiest thing to acquire...even with a blue print for a nuclear bomb, you'd stillhave to have that key ingredient...as for the $100,000 and a soviet chemist, as a boy on the farm, I could blow up a beaver dam real good with a simple fertelizer bomb that cost less than $25 to make...while we're putting up missile shields, shouldn't we also be watching out for guys with a can of comet and bottle of clorox...or even good old silver nitrate, that can be gotten at most high school and chemsitry labs? The planes were taken down with penknives and boxcutters, no explosives, chemicals, etc.

Colin, maybe you did, but did anyone else here have the fun in physics class creating "water"...wild what happens when you combine hydrogen and oxygen...heheheh...not an indoor experiment...
SykkBoy

I for one, am not ready to give up my civil liberties to live a life of poverty, and opression, no matter how "safe" it makes me:)


grimm Xingster

We as a country are in a position where we have no choice, we can no longer allow terrorist and regimes that support them to exist
If we do not eliminate then, the terrorist attacks will continue

The countries that harbor terrorists have been given an opportunity to turn over terrorists thereby saving them and us from military actions

Very glad Turkey is in full support of the USA as they are strategically located in the Middle East and have a vast Muslim population

Wish the news media would back off a little or at least be used for misdirection/misinformation
Given their reporting of the past 2 weeks that would not be too hard

Serge - good to see you home safe and sound
Vick Almost ready No Peeking Well we don't pay $70 a join but .... Still a good deal

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/010921/12/c4svw.html
grimm Xingster

serge..the beauty of this country, is that you have the right to say what you feel, even if nobody wants to hear it;)

That is why you don;t quash demonstations, they send as clear a message to the enemy as presidential speeches that this is a great country.


grimm Xingster

Great article

http://abcnews.go.com/sections/us/DailyNews/WTC_americanthinkers_010921.html


grimm Xingster

I look at NYU students on CNN and it disgusts me...those guys won't sell america-
they would GIVE it away!
Serge

and one more subject....
don't you think that civil liberties we all enjoy put our lives in jeopardy?

I see terrorists as prime beneficiaries of those freedoms.

do you know how many planes were hi-jacked in former Soviet Union?

I only know about ONE plot which was foiled,
jewish dissedents from Leningrad.

makes me think...
Serge

Actually Sig was contacted by the FBI about some domains and who registered them this week. But that is all I can say...
Mike AI
**************

I wish you said even less...
Serge

But if we let countries like Iraq, IRan, North Korea stay intact with their current regimes - then we should get a anti-missile shield.

I am one who thinks the best defense is a GREAT offense. So I say it is time to wipe out all terrorists and rogue nations. PERIOD!


Mike AI
***************

no arguments from me.

as for availablity...
I heard the guy on CNN who can create chemical weapons with one soviet chemist and $100,000 worth of common chemicals,
something one can't do to create a nuke device.
Serge

Serge no doubt about domain names, but someone mentioned it here tuesday. I was just point out the article to show the big brains we have here at Oprano.

Actually Sig was contacted by the FBI about some domains and who registered them this week. But that is all I can say...
Mike AI Football pickem gearing back up - can anyone beat KK???

BTW,
as soon as I left-
Turkey pledged full support to USA actions.


Serge

Do you really believe that nucs which are much more harder to obtain are REAL threat???
________________

Serge - depending on how we follow up on this war on terrorism, I think it may be a real threat. If we truly conduct war on terrorism like Scipio did in the third war with Carthage - then no I do not think we need a anti-missile shield.

But if we let countries like Iraq, IRan, North Korea stay intact with their current regimes - then we should get a anti-missile shield.

I am one who thinks the best defense is a GREAT offense. So I say it is time to wipe out all terrorists and rogue nations. PERIOD!


Mike AI Football pickem gearing back up - can anyone beat KK???

Mike,
those domains could hardly indicate anything
they are good as "looking back" items,
how many crazy domains registerd every day?
Serge

Where I live the local radio station, power96.com, is telling it's listeners the way to be patriotic is to go shopping and spend money.
*******************

Cleo,
that would help too,
if nobody spends money-
recession deepens and ...terrorists win.
Serge

A missle defense system is important - I think the months events should demonstrate that. It goes hand in hand with fighting terrorism.


Mike AI
****************

sorry, mate but this is PURE bullshit.

TODAY,
I came into United States of America with 2 suit cases which were not opened by customs and even if they were opened,
if there was chemical or bio weapon inside
and XRAY doesn't show them
1/2 of NY State be dead by tomorrow.

Do you really believe that nucs which are much more harder to obtain are REAL threat???

c'mon, Mike!


Serge

Breaux is an honorable guy, and he does know about Energy and thus would have been a good Sec. of Energy.

Mary and her family, her father is the begining of what brought New Orleans to the pitiful city it is now... :-(

At times like this, we are ALL Americans. I can distinguish between liberals who love their Country, and liberals who could care less about the USA ( those who claim the flag is oppressive, etc...)
Mike AI Football pickem gearing back up - can anyone beat KK???

Mike :)

I had a feeling you were going to say something like that, I just knew it bro. I know most all the 100 senators indepth, but don't know much about Mary, in Local state Politics. The interviews I have seen of her were ok, but she didn't seem to strike me to hard.. John Breaux is ok, I could see him as a VP or something some day. I do disagree with him on a few things, and was worried for a bit there when Bush wanted him in the cabinet, I was already thinking Traitor:) I def. did't agree with him on the tax cut and of course on that False hood of a rebate check, that was never going to revive this sinking economy. but except for that he is ok, and a dem:) LOL
sextoyking 30% commissions on all sextoy sales!

Hey wasn't some people here talking about this http://www.washtimes.com/national/inbeltway.htm


Signs in cyberspace?

The registry of .com, .org, and .net Internet domain names may have foretold the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon.
Dr. Neil Livingstone, CEO of Global Options LLC, a Washington-based counterterrorism and investigations company, believes terrorists, or their co-conspirators who orchestrated the attacks, may have registered as many as 17 Internet domain names that could have tipped off authorities as early as last summer, it is being reported by CNSNews.com.
Here are some the eerie registered domain names, which just expired:
• worldtradetowerattack.com
• tradetowerstrike.com
• worldtradetowerstrike.com
• horrorinamerica.com
• horrorinnewyork.com
• nycterroriststrike.com
• pearlharborinmanhattan.com
• terrorattack2001.com
• towerofhorror.com
• terroristattack2001.com
Four Web addresses re-registered after the attacks:
• attackamerica.com
• attackonamerica.com
• attackontwintowers.com
• worldtradecenterbombs.com
"It is unbelievable that somebody [in the law enforcement or Internet field] didn't say 'Hello?' and pick up on this," one official who deals with the federal government on Internet-related issues tells Inside the Beltway


Mike AI Football pickem gearing back up - can anyone beat KK???

Where I live the local radio station, power96.com, is telling it's listeners the way to be patriotic is to go shopping and spend money.

I say we put Serge in charge of defense.

Cleo Cleo's Links

A missle defense system is important - I think the months events should demonstrate that. It goes hand in hand with fighting terrorism.


Mike AI Football pickem gearing back up - can anyone beat KK???

Todd no doubt Berkley is a good school, and has many smart people who graduate there. However, many of these people are misguided and ignorant to the way the world really works.

My Senators? One Breaux is ok, a moderate democrate - the other Mary Landrui is a STUPID bitch, her entire family are morons, none of them had a real job in theri entire lives - they all live off the gov't dole being politicians.


Mike AI Football pickem gearing back up - can anyone beat KK???

Mike,
I would have to disagree, I think that college ranks up in the top 10, I would be proud to send my kids there:)

So I guess you don't support the great senators from your state either??
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Todd,
I hope Bush will use $$$ earmarked for missle defence to fight terrorism
Serge

Serge,

what I mean buy open checkbook, has nothing to do with paying for a battle or anything, but if you watch all the news, you will see stuff getting through the house and senate in days, which normally takes weeks or months, Shit even alot of repubs were asking where the debate is.. I like open debate. I am more talking about Missle Defense, etc.

As I said before, when we goto battle, we goto win, np on $$$ there.
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Dean,
it was my g/f idea,
I'll try e-mailing it tomorrow to FBI..becaus eit's KISS formul;a at it's best
Serge

Serge,

your example for your son is a good one. Sure I don't want to kill innocent ppl either, but the sad fact is, we have to Sqaush this kind of terror in the bud. I have no problems with that. I fully support that if we goto into war, we go there to win... As a soldier in germany in 1986-1988, I remember every 4 months, being a few clicks away from the berlin wall, and wondering what night the alarm would sound, and being told tonight wasn't a Drill....

I am very Patriotic, but I am also very liberal:)

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...2 of the fuckers were on most wanted list and FBI would wait for them at the counter if they implemented this very simple procedure...


that is just incredible !!!



General (What's NEW?)

I support full retaliation in response to the attack on our soil, but I don't support for to long, an open checkbook from the Congress.
******************

and how many more civilians should die 'till Mr. Todd says:
WE SHOULD ERADICATE THE PROBLEMS REGARDLESS HOW MUCH IT COSTS?

Serge

HAHAHA Serge, great minds....
Mike AI Football pickem gearing back up - can anyone beat KK???

Its a breeding ground for political correctness
*****************

ha! how come we use the same terms?
;_)
Serge

No comment on the new Homeland Defense cabinet level job. I won't play politics on this whole issue, until the "battle" is over. We have soldiers going into harms way, so I will show my respect.. As a former soldier I will respect this 1 term pres on this issue. but will be ready to play some Hardball next year.. I support full retaliation in response to the attack on our soil, but I don't support for to long, an open checkbook from the Congress. But I know Most democrats and some Repubs can't speak out, as they would look very bad politically:(

Shit, Mariners and Oakland in a few.

peace

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So It's a great liberal bastion of this country, and the point is?? :))
*****************

Todd,
here is the point I made to my 13 years old who doesn't like to see 6 mils of innocent afganies suffer from our attack

I gave her this example.

there is only one kind of moscito which spreads malaria.
The only way to kill this moscito is to chemically poison the swamp where those moscito breeds.

thousands of innocent inscts who have nothing to do with malaria die as well but....would we rather go and save those innocent insects and let people die?

sorry, I never went to Berkley....
Serge

Mike,

Berkley is great school. Many great people have gone there, many minds have been sculptured there.. So It's a great liberal bastion of this country, and the point is?? :))
_________________

Its a breeding ground for political correctness, for defeatism, for moral relativism, for re-writing history, and basicly for the decay of what we see in modern America.

Can you really support people who think the American flag should not be flown on a firetruck? ? Who beleive that the American Flag represents hate and opression? Who thinks all people in the military are evil?


Mike AI Football pickem gearing back up - can anyone beat KK???

The host asked a councilman why the firefighters could not display the flag on a fire engine...

o reilly couldn't seem to get a straight answer...wasn't that the district with the 'lone' dissenting vcote in congress?

Fold http://

Serge I am ready to make you Czar of Homeland Defense!
**************************

I wouldn't be popular with liberals
but the job would have been done in the best Stalin traditions
;-)
Serge

Mike,

Berkley is great school. Many great people have gone there, many minds have been sculptured there.. So It's a great liberal bastion of this country, and the point is?? :))
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Serge I am ready to make you Czar of Homeland Defense!


OldFold don't get me started on the bleeding heart liberals - especially from Berkley. My girlfriends mom went to undergrad and alw school there - on scholarship.... you can imagine the conversations we have.


Mike AI Football pickem gearing back up - can anyone beat KK???

>>> The likelyhood of me EVER flying again is on par with the chances of kimmykim entering a convent,or dravyk being in GQs "10 most eligible batchelors

I totally disagree with that. Jayman, get GQ in here. I'm sure he said I was one of the top 5 most eligible bachelors on his list. :-)

>>> I am in a good mood btw as it is confirmed I am one of the most popular people in the USA, being both brit and canadian

... Which explains why you always drive your car on the white line, and don't know how to spell or pronounce anything. :-P

Dravyk hello, I am a tagline

and the other thing which could foil the attack and is EASY to implement.

when you fly-
your ID is checked at the counter.

whooptie do,
they have no either time nor d/b to check against "most wanted"

WHY IN THE GOD'S NAME NOBODY CHECKS
the names against d/b when one makes RESERVATION??????

2 of the fuckers were on most wanted list and FBI would wait for them at the counter if they implemented this very simple procedure...





Serge

"The great battleground for the defence and expansion of freedom today is the whole southern half of the globe ... the lands of the rising peoples. Their revolution is the greatest in human history. They seek an end to injustice, tyranny and exploitation. More than an end, they seek a beginning."

John Kennedy
grimm Xingster

-------
I hope you are talking about civilians
-------

Most definitely talking about civilians.. the armed forces look very strong & ready.

For that I am thankful.
Hooper

The only way the war will be won is with total media blackout.

There are no "rules" in this type of war.

Rules of engagement,etc will be like fighting one hand behind the back.

They will have no constraints.We shouldn't.

There populace will only hear positive propaganda,unless cnn agree to report same they should be excluded.

The bill of rights if followed will turn Americas strength into its weakness.

As always,time and body bags may reduce Americas resolve.

If I was Prez,I would actually "plant" a few devices myself in Americas heartland,blame bin lauden,maintain the resolve of the people.But then I'm amoral ;))
Nick

these idiots on the O Rielly factor can't even answer a straight question...

Where The F**k is Berkeley anyways?
Fold http://

Mike,
glad to be home and among friends
and family

Hopper
"I don't know that anybody can every know whether they are ready to fight until the gun is in their hand & it's time to pull the trigger."

I hope you are talking about civilians and not our armed forces....
from what I saw on TV,
armed forces are mentally ready.
Serge

interesting side observation how people react based upong gender and national origin.....

there were americans, candiens, australians and new zealanders on the bus we travelled in Turkey.

The news about first airplane hitting the WTC tower came via cell phone when we were about 20 mins away from out hotel in Ankara where we stayed overnight.

when we reached the hotel,
EVERYBODY rushed to the big screen TV in the lobby to get the news except few OZ women who looked for our guide to dispence them room keys ASAP....their husbands remained with USA crowd at TV...
Serge

yes, Mike
war is and UGLY business and CNN doesn't help the morale,
as there are no victimless wars.

How the heck did we manage to win WW2 without CNN?????

will we use second nuk in Japan which ended the war and saved thousands of AMERICAN lives if CNN questioned survivors with lost limbs after teh first bomb?

I doubt..cause
"we don't do those things" mentality.

Call me names, but I don't believe for a second that the best arms wins....
the best RESOLVE wins,
as russians proved in 1918 when they fought with 14 industrial countries, including USA, and won,
Viet Congs won against our superior weapons,
afgans won against russians superior weapons

I wish soldiers do their job and CNN
stays home,
I don't need to know every move,
cuz those fuckers know it too.

Bush called for resolve in his speach yesterday,
I say we NEED it and we need to prepare ourselves mentally that in order to win and safe the world certain ugliness is acceptable,
and our enemies ARE OUR ENEMIES
or 7000+ in WTC died for nothing.
Serge

I am off to have dinner with the folks - but I wanted to tell Serge, that I missed him and that I am glad he got home safely!


Mike AI Football pickem gearing back up - can anyone beat KK???

I don't know that anybody can every know whether they are ready to fight until the gun is in their hand & it's time to pull the trigger.

I personally have too many injuries to actually fight, I don't know about others my age....
Hooper

Serge we have the ability to do what we want to do - the real question is do we have the political will, and stomach to DO what we have to do.

Real war is an ugly business... American's are used to "nitendo" wars - with smart bombs, and 100 hour vitories. It is not going to be case in this war.

My girlfriend and I was watchng Band Of Brothrs - and she saw the scene where the paratrooper shot the German prisoners - she told me that we did not do things like this. I had to explain to her WE did, not on the levels that other people did - but when a paratrooper has landed and has objects to seize it is impossible to take prisoners of war...


Mike AI Football pickem gearing back up - can anyone beat KK???

since we have the largest problem with 15 year olds killing eachother in classrooms and on the streets...

*******************

Hooper,
they better snap out of this infantilism quick...for THEIRS and OURS sake.

Serge

hooper

are you and your friends ready to fight?
I think Serge is right.
Vietnam was the first time Americans got to see daily almost live pictures of their boys fighting
and dying. And in the sixties it was only 10 minutes out of a half hour newscast not 24 hours round the clock on 100 different channels.
It helped turn American opinion against US involvement in that conflict.


mutt