The Deecash Plot Thickens

[gonzo]

Porn Valley- There for awhile iBangPornStars.com was touting itself as one of the most visited adult sites in creation.

But that’s not stopping Chef Jeff, who was banging the porn stars, from leaving the operation. Jeff is joining the US Army. And why, especially at his age, would he be leaving such a “lucrative” operation you ask, and be opting for khakis instead?

That’s part of the story. Jeff had plans on leaving porn going back a year and a half ago. Which he did for a couple of weeks until a former Marine sent an e-mail informing the city of Surprise, Arizona of Jeff’s porn past. Jeff, a former tennis pro, had been working an administrative job in the city’s tennis program but was fired when all that information came to light.

That’s when Chef hooked up with Mayorsmoney.com and started the iBangPornStars website. But in recent weeks, Jeff was doing little or no P.R. to promote the website, whereas in the beginning he came out of the gate like gangbusters.

However, earlier this year, Mayormoney sold their company to Dee Cash on the fact that the website was performing so well. Dee Cash is in the process of acquiring a lot of programs and companies.

The original plan was that Dee Cash was going to put resources behind the site and send more traffic to it. Instead, it was just the opposite. From the time Dee Cash purchased iBangPornStars they rarely updated the free area since its purchase. And in the members area they’ve only updated two new episodes. Apparently leaving the site stagnating is part of the new business model.

The owner of Dee Cash supposedly said that with his experience, even if he didn’t sink another penny into it, it’s still going to do the same number of joins and sales just because of the sheer volume of links and traffic it already gets.

True. Since the updates ceased, the site does the same number of sales. The site, on the other hand, also banks on aggressive billing tactics.

A trial membership is a dollar. But on the join page there are two boxes at the bottom of the page which are already checked. These are called “cross sales”. If the customer doesn’t uncheck those boxes, he’s automatically billed for joining two additional sites at full price which is $39.95 for each site.

Which means a lot of people who participate in trial sign ups will be billed $81. The option is given you to uncheck the boxes, but the system banks on the fact that most people won’t bother to scroll down the page and even notice.

After someone signs on for a trial membership, the next billing practice is put into effect which is called the “instant upgrade”. So when you have a trial membership and go into the members area, you can browse around but the minute you click on something, be it a video or photo, that means you’ve just agreed to upgrade to a full membership at $39.95. Which means theoretically a trial membership can cost you $121.

With the fact that their affiliates send them traffic for which they pay $30 to $35 a signup, Dee Cash is still generating a pretty good piece of change. And most customers never bother to complain, anyway, about porn bills on their credit cards. With the fact that the company is located in the Philippines means that customer service isn’t exactly to the ready.

The army story is that Jeff wants to pursue a career in photojournalism and eventually land a job with a large publication. He decided that the means of doing this was by taking advantage of the army’s program. But if you talked to Jeff in recent weeks you could tell he was burning out from the porn business.

[RawAlex]

One of the reasons to buy programs that are on NATS or move them to NATS is to better handle these sorts of cross sales. Better to sell across your different sites if you have them. Just as good if you are trying to make the most money in a very short time before the "end of the porn business".

Good luck to Jeff, I am sure he will do well in whatever he choses to do.

[DannyCox]

I was curious about a few things, so I went to check Alexa rankings for sites that were acquired by DeeCash. Every one of them has dropped in traffic, some drastically.

I also had a look at some of the sites that I knew fairly well, and nothing is being updated anywhere. An example if the Join Right Now sites, nothing has been updated in a few months. I see the posts on GFY where the guys are falling over themselves to talk about how great things get when DeeCash takes over, but I just don't see the results. Every program we promoted that was taken over by DC has resulted in a big decrease in revenue. We've now pulled everything we had that was going to programs now run by DC, and replaced them with much smaller programs and seeing 5 to 10 times the results.

There is something really fishy going on with all this.

[gonzo]

I was curious about a few things, so I went to check Alexa rankings for sites that were acquired by DeeCash. Every one of them has dropped in traffic, some drastically.

I also had a look at some of the sites that I knew fairly well, and nothing is being updated anywhere. An example if the Join Right Now sites, nothing has been updated in a few months. I see the posts on GFY where the guys are falling over themselves to talk about how great things get when DeeCash takes over, but I just don't see the results. Every program we promoted that was taken over by DC has resulted in a big decrease in revenue. We've now pulled everything we had that was going to programs now run by DC, and replaced them with much smaller programs and seeing 5 to 10 times the results.

There is something really fishy going on with all this.
Deecash buys them their drinks.

[RawAlex]

Danny, same sort of guys who pretty much blew Legendary Lars on the boards even as AFF bought tons of traffic from Zango which likely reduced commissions by affiliates... especially funny when guys had their sites targeted and still got on their knees.

It is always amazing what happens between Bros.

[gonzo]

It is always amazing what happens between Bros.
You will soon forget them in 6 months as they ask you if youd like it toasted or not.

[Greg B]

I can applaud a person changing careers and phooey on people who used this guys porn past to derail his dreams. Forgiveness is the only way we progress as a species.

[softball]

I can applaud a person changing careers and phooey on people who used this guys porn past to derail his dreams. Forgiveness is the only way we progress as a species.

Darwin doesn't forgive.....

[tony404]

it seems more and more people are turning to prechecked cross sales. My guess is with the shit economy there has been a dip and they are scared. I asked one big fish on the jungle and he told me he did them to make more money and to keep competitive. What does slamming some customers credit card have to do with staying competitive I dont have a clue. The thing that will suck is when visa makes cb's .5 % they will have the balls to say why are they picking on us?

[tony404]

I wish Jeff the best,he seems like a very nice guy. I dont understand joining the army to become a photojournalist. From what I read about going into that field, there is a guy has a blog about it. The army doesnt seem like the way to go.

[DannyCox]

The prechecked cross sales are nothing new. Most of the old big players did that years ago, and then with the huge increase in CBs, were forced to stop or lose their merchant accounts.

My opinion in all this (and word I received last night) is that Deecash is just going to quickly take advantage of the cross sales and the profits, get their money out, and let everything die. We'll have lots of programs gone very shortly which will help open things up for the rest of us. It's a bad thing for the customer, but can be a good thing for many of us as their current affiliates will need places to put their traffic.

[EmporerEJ]

The prechecked cross sales are nothing new. Most of the old big players did that years ago, and then with the huge increase in CBs, were forced to stop or lose their merchant accounts.

My opinion in all this (and word I received last night) is that Deecash is just going to quickly take advantage of the cross sales and the profits, get their money out, and let everything die. We'll have lots of programs gone very shortly which will help open things up for the rest of us. It's a bad thing for the customer, but can be a good thing for many of us as their current affiliates will need places to put their traffic.

This is exactly the crap that gives the adult industry a bad name. Quick buck artists that are in it to rape the customer, (no pun intended) and run off with the money before anyone notices.

Call it for what it is...a Scam. It's not "cross sales," or any such thing. It's a scam. It's dishonest, and has no place in any business. One of the reasons we don't link to allot of outside companies. I don't want to be attached to anything that even "hints" of scam.

[gonzo]

$81 bucks when your expecting to spend a dollar...what do you expect?

We all know how this story ends anyhow.

Dont give a fuck where Deepak lives. People are serving time.
Going to be a huge glut of affiliate managers on the market soon as well.

Danny is right though. It will take some of the shit stain out of the surfers faces.
The entire playing field is going to be different within as little as 3 years.

[gonzo]

This is exactly the crap that gives the adult industry a bad name. Quick buck artists that are in it to rape the customer, (no pun intended) and run off with the money before anyone notices.

Call it for what it is...a Scam. It's not "cross sales," or any such thing. It's a scam. It's dishonest, and has no place in any business. One of the reasons we don't link to allot of outside companies. I don't want to be attached to anything that even "hints" of scam.

Doesnt this put the rude.com purchase in perspective now?

Huge list of people to spam via private mail for $1 tours.
All of the solo girls on there are nothing more than free content to rope the unaware into $81 rebilling charges.

[sarettah]

lol. This is some funny shit.

The shit I am seeing out there makes Crescent look mild.

Same thing, different day. Take out Crescent, nothing changes, same tactics, same shit. On and on, over and over.

It's so pretty, it goes round and round and round and round................

[gonzo]

lol. This is some funny shit.

The shit I am seeing out there makes Crescent look mild.

Same thing, different day. Take out Crescent, nothing changes, same tactics, same shit. On and on, over and over.

It's so pretty, it goes round and round and round and round................
And the dumbasses still send the traffic. . .

[sarettah]

And the dumbasses still send the traffic. . .

Yeppirs, and then they bitch about how bad all those tactics make the internet adult industry look and how the scammers are ruining the biz.

Like I said, round and round and round.....

[DannyCox]

To tell you the truth, I gave up on most people in this industry back around 2000. All I ever saw was a bunch of "Sheep" just "Stampeding" after whatever the perceived Big Guys told them was the next best thing. 98% of the guys at the zoo still only promote the more visible programs, and these tend to be programs with the worse content for the niche they are offering websites in. They then talk about the amazing conversions and retentions they all get, when we all know it is pure bullshit.

We have quietly been promoting the smaller niche sites over the years, and doing a hell of a lot better than anything you can do with a large, over priced, and extremely saturated site. My typical rule is if a program or site becomes too popular, I drop it and move on to something else.

We have sites in our Network that really do convert well and still have amazing retention. A little site like http://www.wifecrazy.com really hooks the surfers and her amazing personality really keeps them around. But because it isn't "slick" looking (ie. looks like every other site out there), affiliates won't touch it. We have a few making a killing from that site. We also have other sites in the mature and stocking niches that do really well. The difference is these are all real women running their own sites with their own personalities. That's what works, not overly Photoshopped images and slick graphics, but the connection between the woman and her fan.

The types of sites we have is what I also look at to promote as I know it sells well. Anyone who truly understands this Industry would understand that. Unfortunately, the majority of affiliates truly are idiots who just can't think for themselves. They have to be told what to do and will only listen to people who have huge post counts at the zoo. Most of the big posters over there actually do very little. After all, when you spend your day and night posting on everything, you aren't doing any work that will truly bring you money.

[gonzo]

To tell you the truth, I gave up on most people in this industry back around 2000. All I ever saw was a bunch of "Sheep" just "Stampeding" after whatever the perceived Big Guys told them was the next best thing. 98% of the guys at the zoo still only promote the more visible programs, and these tend to be programs with the worse content for the niche they are offering websites in. They then talk about the amazing conversions and retentions they all get, when we all know it is pure bullshit.

We have quietly been promoting the smaller niche sites over the years, and doing a hell of a lot better than anything you can do with a large, over priced, and extremely saturated site. My typical rule is if a program or site becomes too popular, I drop it and move on to something else.

We have sites in our Network that really do convert well and still have amazing retention. A little site like http://www.wifecrazy.com really hooks the surfers and her amazing personality really keeps them around. But because it isn't "slick" looking (ie. looks like every other site out there), affiliates won't touch it. We have a few making a killing from that site. We also have other sites in the mature and stocking niches that do really well. The difference is these are all real women running their own sites with their own personalities. That's what works, not overly Photoshopped images and slick graphics, but the connection between the woman and her fan.

The types of sites we have is what I also look at to promote as I know it sells well. Anyone who truly understands this Industry would understand that. Unfortunately, the majority of affiliates truly are idiots who just can't think for themselves. They have to be told what to do and will only listen to people who have huge post counts at the zoo. Most of the big posters over there actually do very little. After all, when you spend your day and night posting on everything, you aren't doing any work that will truly bring you money.

This is a great post and youve recanted something that several of us have known for a long time.

This is one of the reasons I put the am board on here to encourage some of the smaller solo sites to promote themselves here to several people that I know that will take advantage of it.

[LAJ]

ChefJeff IS a great guy. I wish him only the best, and it's too bad how he was neglected after the sale.

[softball]

Wasn't Chef Jeff involved with AM?

[gonzo]

Wasn't Chef Jeff involved with AM?
THe guy has had a total run of bad luck.

[softball]

THe guy has had a total run of bad luck.
I recall he was a great guy.

[dirkg]

We have sites in our Network that really do convert well and still have amazing retention. A little site like [wifecrazy.com really hooks the surfers .........

I find sites like this a lot in some smaller niches that I want to promote. Problem is there is no easy way to find the affiliate page or the site looks so home made that I just figure its got no affiliates and get pissed off and leave. I guess I will just have to start sending out emails.

[Greg B]

To tell you the truth, I gave up on most people in this industry back around 2000. All I ever saw was a bunch of "Sheep" just "Stampeding" after whatever the perceived Big Guys told them was the next best thing. 98% of the guys at the zoo still only promote the more visible programs, and these tend to be programs with the worse content for the niche they are offering websites in. They then talk about the amazing conversions and retentions they all get, when we all know it is pure bullshit.

We have quietly been promoting the smaller niche sites over the years, and doing a hell of a lot better than anything you can do with a large, over priced, and extremely saturated site. My typical rule is if a program or site becomes too popular, I drop it and move on to something else.

We have sites in our Network that really do convert well and still have amazing retention. A little site like http://www.wifecrazy.com really hooks the surfers and her amazing personality really keeps them around. But because it isn't "slick" looking (ie. looks like every other site out there), affiliates won't touch it. We have a few making a killing from that site. We also have other sites in the mature and stocking niches that do really well. The difference is these are all real women running their own sites with their own personalities. That's what works, not overly Photoshopped images and slick graphics, but the connection between the woman and her fan.

The types of sites we have is what I also look at to promote as I know it sells well. Anyone who truly understands this Industry would understand that. Unfortunately, the majority of affiliates truly are idiots who just can't think for themselves. They have to be told what to do and will only listen to people who have huge post counts at the zoo. Most of the big posters over there actually do very little. After all, when you spend your day and night posting on everything, you aren't doing any work that will truly bring you money.

Right the fuck on! That's it, nuff freakin' said!

I found out the past year how much bullshit is slung around this industry. That I was making more than the majority of people and I don't even have a million sites like some guys. Gonzo, Hammer, Legacy and a few others knows what I'm talking about because I've been nagging and studying for a year. Got all my statistics up and growing. I stopped promoting the big sites because why send 10,000 hits to make one sale when you can divert that traffic to a smaller pro niche based program and get 10 sales.

Everything you've said about this industry is true but one thing you left out and that's the underhanded attacks by cliques and dumbasses who can't earn a sale they have to steal one. That's the #1 thing that's going to end this industry are the fuckups in it.

[softball]

ah the holy grail of porn....the niche. When I first started in this business, you couldn't convince anyone there was money in niche. They all thought mainstream porn was all there was. As the money runs out, they are grasping at straws, but very few people can really promote niche. And I do mean very few.

[Toby]

...but very few people can really promote niche. And I do mean very few.
...and the reason for that is pretty basic. Very few really understand the niches they promote. So they're just throwing spaghetti at the wall.

[pam]

Wait, there's money in niches and sub-niches?

[softball]

Wait, there's money in niches and sub-niches?

no no no shhhhh there be dragons. Money is in teens and milfs

[EmporerEJ]

Doesnt this put the rude.com purchase in perspective now?

Huge list of people to spam via private mail for $1 tours.
All of the solo girls on there are nothing more than free content to rope the unaware into $81 rebilling charges.

Is that what they're doing?
Knowing some of those involved, (still involved?) I find it hard to believe they would do that. If true, it's dissapointing.

[DannyCox]

It is very true. If you go to the join page at http://secure.ibangpornstars.com/signup/presignup.php , put in a fake e-mail address and select one of the billing options you get the sign-up page. They have to pre-checked boxes that say nothing about a charge but do have small asterisks next to them. The page is designed so that the information on the charge is below the viewable area. One site has a 2 day trial that recurs at $39.97, the other has a single day trial that recurs at $39.97. We all know from history that maybe only 1 in 10 people will even notice that.

Therefore, a surfer drops in, sees the great deal of only $1.00 for a 3 day trial and signs up without noticing the pre-checked boxes or what they even mean. Next thing he knows, he's been billed for $80.94 and probably never even looked at the other sites. Many people don't even realize they can charge back, and just let it go, forever pissed off at all of us. That little trick costs us all members.

[MRock]

I knew I've been doing something wrong all of these years! Now I know the missing ingrediant ... deception. (joke)

[Hammer]

Tricking members when they sign up is a low thing to do but this isn't the only business that does it, they all do in one way or another. In porn it makes no sense to me though because surely most of those people end up charging back.

[Toby]

Pre-checked cross sales are just a piss poor way of doing business no matter how any of the sponsors using them try to justify the practice.

[Toby]

Add one more program to the list.

Pleased to announce "DeeCash Acquires StfuCash and we've relaunched the program...

[gonzo]

Add one more program to the list.
Vipesh...another jerk off. He used to hit me up for more traffic. I asked him about buying advertising here and they werent adding any more ads... so I wasnt adding anymore sponsors.

Looks like they got em a fresj processing account with this one.

[RawAlex]

While some on GFY are claiming this is a "great thing", I think all these purchases are nothing more than proof that there is going to be a huge reduction in the numbers of players in the next 6 months or so... in fact, I can see many programs (and webmasters) having a hard time making it out of summer.

[tony404]

It's on gfy he bought stfu cash also. My guess is sales have dropped and people want out. Now I heard its payments not a outright sale. If that's the case, I would never do that you buy it buy it all in one shot. I had a friend who sold his restaurant that way in payments, he had it back in 6 months.

[RawAlex]

okay, here's a little more for this discussion:

Deecash took over Meatcash this week (I gather). They are running $100 PPS special right now. The deal? The signup page includes 2 prechecked cross sales at $39.97 each (1 day $1 trials on them) plus the original site ($1 trial). So within 24 hours, they are even on your payout and in 3 days they are profitable... 34 days from now they have made back your payout...

So total day 1 sale is $3. day 2 adds $79.94, and day 3 adds another $39.97 (for the original site). $100 PPS on this isn't hard when you are hitting the client effectively for $122.91 up front.

I personally think they are buying tons of programs so they have tons of different routes to cross bill through. The are generating an apparent ton of sales because they are tripling up every purchase.

[Toby]

...I personally think they are buying tons of programs so they have tons of different routes to cross bill through. The are generating an apparent ton of sales because they are tripling up every purchase.

At some point you also have to hold the processors partly responsible for allowing the practice. They're making some coin here too in processing fees, and somehow seem to be avoiding the dreaded chargeback issues.

[gonzo]

At some point you also have to hold the processors partly responsible for allowing the practice. They're making some coin here too in processing fees, and somehow seem to be avoiding the dreaded chargeback issues.
Mitch from Netbilling says prechecked cross sales are ok.

[RawAlex]

Mitch from Netbilling says prechecked cross sales are ok.

I think that Mitch might end up with a different opinion when the chargebacks start to pile up. My personal feeling is that this is the sort of deal that takes months if not a year to truly play out, where people start looking and start charging back months and months of stuff they didn't think they agreed to.

I also think this is a much faster way to push a card past it's limit and push members out the door.

[RawAlex]

The newest promo is a $200 PPS that has all the zoo-philes in a lather. 2 prechecked cross sales and a statement that you agree to the terms and conditions, but there is no terms and conditions link on either of the signup pages.

My theory is if they can pay $200PPS, then they are likely making more than that on every signup.

[Toby]

It's getting increasingly difficult to stay far enough upwind to avoid the stink.

[Nymph]

Anyone else here leary of joining any new progs for fear they might get bought up too?

I've had at least one of mine bought & put in the mix already. This was a few months ago, and they still don't have all the promo material right, and conversions have gone to shit.

[EmporerEJ]

It's getting increasingly difficult to stay far enough upwind to avoid the stink.

Amen to that.

[EmporerEJ]

Amen to that.

(Not that I'm a religious man, but you get the sentiment)

[Toby]

...they still don't have all the promo material right, and conversions have gone to shit.That seems to be a recurring theme with most of the programs they've bought.

Fortunately for me very few multi-site programs have fetishwear sites worth promoting.

However, should Dee happen to buy a program that I am currently promoting, my links would come down quickly and I'd send that traffic somewhere else.

[RawAlex]

I think what makes me laugh is that if you have been around the biz for a while, you know what comes right after these stupidly high payouts...

[RawAlex]

Sorry, can't let this go... a true two shotter today:

1) About half the threads at this moment on the zoo are insane payout promotions for various Deecash sites ($100 - $200 PPS on $1 trials?)

2) Mr Deecash himself proved to be a top notch standup guy and a bro by buying tons of champagne in Vegas at the xbiz deal.

I am guessing the people at the zoo are too young to recognize the pattern here.

[tony404]

Sorry, can't let this go... a true two shotter today:

1) About half the threads at this moment on the zoo are insane payout promotions for various Deecash sites ($100 - $200 PPS on $1 trials?)

2) Mr Deecash himself proved to be a top notch standup guy and a bro by buying tons of champagne in Vegas at the xbiz deal.

I am guessing the people at the zoo are too young to recognize the pattern here.

you are a wise man:)

[RawAlex]

Well the $200 a join deal with join right now is backfiring, thread over at the zoo is showing people get 1 in 3000 and 1 in 5000 conversions, and worse getting it on bought traffic they paid more to get. Oddly nobody from Deecash is answering on that thread.

[DannyCox]

As Karl Marx said, "History repeats itself, first as tragedy, second as farce"

We are in the farce phase, and the guys who buy into all this deserve what they get...nothing.


"We learn from history that we learn nothing from history"
- Shaw

[pam]

I never, ever push a sponsor during a special like that. Why? Everyone and their dog is buying up spots, loading up their sites with links.

[RawAlex]

I never, ever push a sponsor during a special like that. Why? Everyone and their dog is buying up spots, loading up their sites with links.

Not just that - no matter how "hot" the sites are, wary surfers will spot the two pre checked $40 each cross sales and run for the hills. They are already more skittish than deer in a shooting range, this just makes them run like a shotgun blast.

Imagine signing up for a $1 3 day trial and staying a member for, I dunno 40 days. You get billed your $1, you get billed $1 for each of 2 more sites, and then you get whacked for $39.97 times 2, plus the original site's 39.97, and then it all whacks you again next month before you see your CC bill. Total damage for 40 days is $242 plus, or about $6 per day!

I smell chargebacks!

[gonzo]

Dee bought everyone Crystal in Vegas. Hes a top notch guy!

[RawAlex]

Stand up dude. A Bro.

[DannyCox]

I just love him, and send all my traffic his way. Hey! Free drinks Dude. He rocks!

[Footman]

Don't people ever remember the saying "If somethings seems too good to be true then it is?"

It always seemed odd to me seeing payouts at those crazy numbers. Logically you'd have to know the program isn't going to lose money so somewhere in the mix someone is getting fucked. The bigger the payout the drier the fuck seems to be.

[softball]

I just love him, and send all my traffic his way. Hey! Free drinks Dude. He rocks! and real champagne. That is expensive. He must be rich.

[RawAlex]

Don't people ever remember the saying "If somethings seems too good to be true then it is?"

It always seemed odd to me seeing payouts at those crazy numbers. Logically you'd have to know the program isn't going to lose money so somewhere in the mix someone is getting fucked. The bigger the payout the drier the fuck seems to be.

It is even more basic: $200 comes from where? The customer. In a business where we are totally lucky these days on mainstream porn sites to retain past 2 months, so the customer has to be paying $100 a month minimum just to make it break even. I can't picture anyone who has been in this business more than a few days thinking that anyone is going to pay $100 a month for anything.

Now, I will say this: The deecash guys are smart on one thing: they only pay the high signup rate if you contact them after the promo by email and tell them your account and how many signups you are claiming, so they aren't paying it out to existing account holders if they don't know about the promo. So I suspect they aren't paying it out on a huge percentage of the business.

Funny, the zoo, is about 30 - 40 % deecash promo these days, and the chuckleheads over there are stupid enough to fall for it.

[virgohippy]

Anyone else here leary of joining any new progs for fear they might get bought up too?

Not really. Can't let stuff like this keep you from getting work done. If they're new and get bought up it's that much easier for me to pull 'em considering I'll have less shit out there.

[RawAlex]

Interesting on the zoo that more and more people are starting to call them out, call out the cross sale hell... like revenue share programs with prechecked cross sales. Nice!

[softball]

I noticed that. Back in the day,they would never have done that. Where do you think this is all going? I think the fallout could be enormous. Just when we were gaining a level of trust, this shit happens.

[tony404]

Interesting on the zoo that more and more people are starting to call them out, call out the cross sale hell... like revenue share programs with prechecked cross sales. Nice!

My favorite is when someone is posting reasons that the prechecked cross sales are a good thing from meeting the customers needs to helping companies survive the lean times. So when Im stuck with .5 cb ratio who do I get to kick in the balls? lol

[gonzo]

My favorite is when someone is posting reasons that the prechecked cross sales are a good thing from meeting the customers needs to helping companies survive the lean times. So when Im stuck with .5 cb ratio who do I get to kick in the balls? lol
You can thank people like Mitch and Epoch who allow this and vendors like Dee and 12clicks whos sites are so weak that they have to trick a surfer into buying.

What else do you do with a poor product?

[tony404]

You can thank people like Mitch and Epoch who allow this and vendors like Dee and 12clicks whos sites are so weak that they have to trick a surfer into buying.

What else do you do with a poor product?

What I don't get is don't these people have any vision to see what going to be coming if this shit keeps up? Visa says we have had enough and decide to pull out of adult, they dont need adult.In the big picture we are nothing.

[gonzo]

What I don't get is don't these people have any vision to see what going to be coming if this shit keeps up? Visa says we have had enough and decide to pull out of adult, they dont need adult.In the big picture we are nothing.
No different than Hooper with his fucking toolbar.
He got his and FUCK YOU!

And Im sure he would tell you that too.

[RawAlex]

gonzo, you hit it exactly. My personal opinion is that the deecash crew has found a hole in the system, a way to game things so they can extra a bunch of money in very short order, but to do it they need tons of programs to have tons of different types of processing so that their system works out. I don't think it is about running a good buisness or selling a great product, but about gaming the CC system and taking advantage of the customer in the short run to make a killing.

$100 and $200 PPS payouts (only if you email them within 24 hours of the end of the special promo time) is a way to extra traffic from the zoo crew. People are starting to wonder why they don't just set up a special payout in NATS. Well, duh!

The move to NATS also allows them to load up a bunch of different processing options for each site and program, which gives them more chance to jam stuff through. Until the acquiring banks catch on and shut down the system, it will keep going.

[tony404]

The problem is it seems sales are down regardless of the bullshit they all throw and many programs are starting to use prechecked cross sales as a way to make up for the loss.
Clicks said it himself on the jungle:
"Here's a clue for the utterly clueless.
If you're a revshare webmaster with a good bit of rebills, its in your best interest to have them not go under. Unreasonable demands from webmasters were tolerated when times were good. Now things are tight and made worse because of affiliates' unreasonable demands. So go on handcuffing the company managing your rebills from making extra money in a bad market. I'm sure in the end, you'll get just what you deserve."

Now fucking over the people who can afford to buy your product isnt good in my limited business knowledge especially in leaner times. lol

[Toby]

Clicks said it himself on the jungle:
"Here's a clue for the utterly clueless.
If you're a revshare webmaster with a good bit of rebills, its in your best interest to have them not go under."
What a crock of shit. Revshare rebills pay for themselves. The program doesn't pay the affiliate until AFTER they've made the sale.

I guess these guys have to justify it somehow in their own minds so they can sleep at night.

[RawAlex]

Clicks misses the point. We aren't talking about upsells inside the members areas, but rather the point of intial sale when the guy first signs up. I give sites the bigs thumbs up for working their membership area for all it is worth, especially upselling things like Cam and other non-competitive products. If he feels he has to stay a rebilling member (that pays me every month) to have access to the cam site inside, then you have done both of us a favor.

Pre-checked cross sales on the intial signup page are a totally different deal.

[RawAlex]

They are going all out for major bro status now: cruise ship party open bar casino thing.

It takes a lot of wool to pull it over everyone's eyes, I guess.

[gonzo]

They are going all out for major bro status now: cruise ship party open bar casino thing.

It takes a lot of wool to pull it over everyone's eyes, I guess.

Lars must be jealous cuz Dee is TOP NOTCH!

[Toby]

And the bro's at the zoo are just eatin' it up. :sheep: :sheep: :sheep: :sheep:

[tony404]

I got to give him credit he never loses his cool.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirty F View Post
This is funded by the 2 prechecked cross sales on the join pages hidden underneath the submit transaction button. Have fun everybody...your free beers are from the 120 euro charges the surfers pay for access to a Deecash site. Why you think they can afford to do this?

Every day 1000's of people get hit by MASSIVE charges after signing up for a Deecash site. These are the people who will never ever buy a porn membership anymore. When Deepak is retired with his millions you will be crying on gfy that you can't get sales anymore.

Have fun at Internext sponsored by top notch, stand up guy Deepal from Dee -fucking over the surfers and affiliates - cash.


Hi Dirty F,

I see that you've posted in a lot of threads of ours and seem to have a grudge against us for some reason.

Let me point out some facts:
1. I have made the most investment in the industry till date. I care about the longevity of this business and we are obviously in it for the long haul.
2. Yes we have 2 prechecked cross sells, and they are visible - like almost every other major affiliate program out there. So why exactly are you jumping on us? This is done so we can maximize revenue for our affiliates and pay them out the highest possible revenue. If you think we are in super high profitability when paying out $50-200 PPS to our affiliates on trial joins , you are wrong. Our affiliates is the sole reason we have grown successful, we are here to support them in anyway possible.
3. We run a very straight forward business. We operate below visa/mc chargebacks threshold, we have excellent customer support. We have an open refund policy for those that have left the cross sell checked by mistake - We also give them free passes just for calling in because we care about our customer base. We don't have any "weird" billing practices. Its as simple as that.
4. We are now also shifting our focus on to delivering a better product, getting more content for our affiliates, giving them the tools that they need.

If you do not want a $45 pps+, we would love to set you up with linkcodes with out any cross sells, its as simple as that.

I dont' mind supporting any of the facts I state. If you like, you can e-mail me directly or contact me and i'd love to have an open discussion with you about this. dee@ |nospam| deedevelopments.com .

In no way am I harming the industry - I owe a lot to this industry , Given my recent investments, I am definetely depending on the longevity. If any affiliate does not like pre-check cross sells on their linkcodes, they can send us a simple e-mail and we will remove them - but of course they will get the lower payout structure.

Everyone, thank you for the support to make this event great. We hope everyone will have a great time on the boat. We've made some special arrangements to make this night great for you.. Lets all have a great time, enjoy and get some solid business done. I'll be available all night for anyone that wants to come over and say hello!

-Dee
__________________

[gonzo]

I got to give him credit he never loses his cool.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirty F View Post
This is funded by the 2 prechecked cross sales on the join pages hidden underneath the submit transaction button. Have fun everybody...your free beers are from the 120 euro charges the surfers pay for access to a Deecash site. Why you think they can afford to do this?

Every day 1000's of people get hit by MASSIVE charges after signing up for a Deecash site. These are the people who will never ever buy a porn membership anymore. When Deepak is retired with his millions you will be crying on gfy that you can't get sales anymore.

Have fun at Internext sponsored by top notch, stand up guy Deepal from Dee -fucking over the surfers and affiliates - cash.


Hi Dirty F,

I see that you've posted in a lot of threads of ours and seem to have a grudge against us for some reason.

Let me point out some facts:
1. I have made the most investment in the industry till date. I care about the longevity of this business and we are obviously in it for the long haul.
2. Yes we have 2 prechecked cross sells, and they are visible - like almost every other major affiliate program out there. So why exactly are you jumping on us? This is done so we can maximize revenue for our affiliates and pay them out the highest possible revenue. If you think we are in super high profitability when paying out $50-200 PPS to our affiliates on trial joins , you are wrong. Our affiliates is the sole reason we have grown successful, we are here to support them in anyway possible.
3. We run a very straight forward business. We operate below visa/mc chargebacks threshold, we have excellent customer support. We have an open refund policy for those that have left the cross sell checked by mistake - We also give them free passes just for calling in because we care about our customer base. We don't have any "weird" billing practices. Its as simple as that.
4. We are now also shifting our focus on to delivering a better product, getting more content for our affiliates, giving them the tools that they need.

If you do not want a $45 pps+, we would love to set you up with linkcodes with out any cross sells, its as simple as that.

I dont' mind supporting any of the facts I state. If you like, you can e-mail me directly or contact me and i'd love to have an open discussion with you about this. dee@ |nospam| deedevelopments.com .

In no way am I harming the industry - I owe a lot to this industry , Given my recent investments, I am definetely depending on the longevity. If any affiliate does not like pre-check cross sells on their linkcodes, they can send us a simple e-mail and we will remove them - but of course they will get the lower payout structure.

Everyone, thank you for the support to make this event great. We hope everyone will have a great time on the boat. We've made some special arrangements to make this night great for you.. Lets all have a great time, enjoy and get some solid business done. I'll be available all night for anyone that wants to come over and say hello!

-Dee
__________________

A lot of people believe their own hype. He sees nothing wrong with what hes doing and he bumped his own thread.

He left out how you have to tell them that you want the promo payout the day after it ends.

They use NATS. Thats easy enough to manage.

[Toby]

I think I'll pass. I don't know 'bout y'all, but I prefer being kissed while I'm getting fucked.

[RawAlex]

He left out the parts about not directly disclosing to Visa who the beneficial owners are of all these programs he is taking over are, he didn't mention the offshore accounts and the shuffle to keep them all from blowing up, he didn't mention that taking over these programs has given him access to more merchant accounts and more options to bill as needed, etc.

His ideas are very, very short term, and the only good news is he is paying out enough money that one fuckup and the whole house of cards collapses quick like.

[DannyCox]

I'm just waiting to see an update on some of the programs they've taken over. Most haven't been touched since they were sold.

As for their customer service. Carol has a member who got caught in the pre-checked sales trap last month. While he was trying to take care of it with them, they charged him again! He was told it was his fault and that the pre-checked boxes were very clear. He was also told that it wasn't his fault he was stupid! The guy wrote Carol asking her what he should do and has been keeping her updated. So far, he hasn't received a refund, and at first was told he wouldn't get one. Now they are just stringing him along. Carol told him to contact Visa and chargeback and to report it as a fraudulent charge.

So much for their customer service.

[Toby]

...So much for their customer service.
But Dee is "TOP NOTCH" how could he let this happen? http://www.dressingforsex.com/images/sarcasm.gif

Many of the sheep at the zoo are still just blindly following along, chasing the dangling carrots of large PPS payouts, but a growing number are making more and more noise about this shady stuff.

I just have my fingers crossed that the aftermath doesn't cause major credit card processing issues for the rest of us.

AVN is reportedly working on an "in-depth unbiased feature on X Sells and their effect on the industry." That ought to be rich. :rolleyes:

[softball]

I just have my fingers crossed that the aftermath doesn't cause major credit card processing issues for the rest of us.

Yeah, to paraphrase that great American philosopher, Yogi Berra, "Its old school all over again."

That cocksucker (excuse me for calling him something useful) is going to cause serious damage to the business. Like many before him. It is an internet porn tradition that draws sighs of admiration from the those who forget what these guys did. Its kinda like the Kennedy family. Thugs who bought respectability. You all know who you are and you all know who they are.

[tony404]

.

Yeah, to paraphrase that great American philosopher, Yogi Berra, "Its old school all over again."

That cocksucker (excuse me for calling him something useful) is going to cause serious damage to the business. Like many before him. It is an internet porn tradition that draws sighs of admiration from the those who forget what these guys did. Its kinda like the Kennedy family. Thugs who bought respectability. You all know who you are and you all know who they are.

thats my biggest fear Visa says fuck you to us,we are seriously fucked.

[RawAlex]

AVN is reportedly working on an "in-depth unbiased feature on X Sells and their effect on the industry." That ought to be rich. :rolleyes:

Annonnced just as Deecash sponsors a big party at Internext!

As a side note, I think that the Deecash stuff is particularly bad because the cross sales are below the submit button, in a position where surfers might not ever actually see them - and further, the details of those cross sales are even further down.

I think that the pre-checked cross sales are bad, and the positioning is a pretty clear indication that they are trying to slip one by. I think if Visa actually looked closely, they would turn off the processing.

[DannyCox]

As I mentioned before, the check boxes are set so that in a standard sized browser window, they sit just below the viewable area. Most people just don't scroll down, but fill out the form and hit submit.

Deepak loves to say that he's doing it all for the affiliates, and of course, not for himself. I remember people screwing everyone 10 years ago, and saying the exact same thing. In fact, his post on GFY reads almost the same as what Levy et al used to post when they were caught doing similar things!

We can bitch all we want, but as long as Dee has the sheep on his side he'll keep screwing with surfers and affiliates alike. He's just a young kid with access to loads of Daddy's dirty money, and I doubt if he even really cares if his program even makes money in the long run. He gets to throw it around now and act like a big boy.