Quote:
Originally posted by Vick@May 29 2004, 11:52 AM
I disagree - it's you who recites the playbook
Chapter and verse and wrap it in the guise of free thinking
PD - on a personal level you're a great guy and in addition ......
You are one of the smartest people I've ever run across
I've yet to ever see you be wrong (or at least admit it)
I did however see you concede a point about a good joke recently 
You know I am in favor of earning as much as possible, but that's not possible within most union structures
Why should anyone allow a union to negotiate for them? I can handle my own salary negotiations just fine (should I ever be in that position again). I don't want to nor do I expect to earn what everyone else is earning. If I am able to contribute more to a company I should be compensated more. Unions don't allow that (at least for the most part- unless there are incentive bonuses)
Unions don't empower, they take away power from the individual
Beyond that I've seen first hand the way unions WASTE THEIR MEMBERS MONEY
Now stuff that in your pipe and smoke it (I've got a light for ya too) 
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I'm never afraid to admit when I'm wrong.
I'm sorry, Vick ... I guess I missed the news release announcing that the Chamber of Commerce has gone out of business. Unions will be rendered completely irrelevant when that happens, and not a day before.
That doesn't mean that I think the so-called unions of today are completely relevant to today's markets. I don't.
I'm not one of those idiots who thinks it is obscene for SWB, as an example, to report profits of 8 billion dollars. Far from it - I want SWB to make as much as they can. HOWEVER, I am from St. Louis, which used to be SWB's national HQ before they left for Texas; and they are still a large regional employer. I've worked for and with SWB in several capacities, and I know a lot of people who work and/or are retired from SWB, as well as having personal reasons for wanting to see their stock do as well as it can.
I do have a problem with a company making 8 billion dollars crying poormouth to its workers, and asking for concessions under the threat of taking jobs overseas. It fails what I consider to be the common sense test.
As far as why anyone should allow a union to negotiate for them ... it's pretty fucking simple. Ten people have a louder voice than one do, Vick. I am quite sure that unions waste their members' money (the inefficincies of scale). My father was technically a Teamster, after all (stayed in the union after going into sales and management only for the benefits). Still in all, I guaran-goddamn-t-you that MOST of the workers who have some of their money wasted also make a damn site more WITH that union than without.