rhetorical, Ryan...if you would be so kind....
 

In the interest of tidyness, if nothing else, I've taken it upon myself to bring a quote of rhetorical's over here to start a new thread. :)

I once knew an erotica writer who did this. She had a spreadsheet made up of people, physical descriptions, positions, keywords, etc., etc. When it came time for her to sit down and work, she'd assemble a story with rather a "Chinese Menu" approach: one from Column A, two from Column B...if you follow that.

Put simply, rhetorical has given you sound advice, Ryan...IF...you can write that way. I'd advise at least giving it a try before you abandon the idea. If it works for you, you'll end up with solid stories that are keyword rich...and there are definitely worse ways to spend your time.

I, unfortunately, can't write that way. I write my porn the same way I write my novels: people walk into my head and I write down what they say and do. A while back I decided to begin a BBW packet...and into my head the lady walked, her life fully in place. (Actually, the man with the BBW fetish walked in first...the lady was right behind him.) I've been telling stories since I first learned to speak, however, so this sort of thing comes naturally to me.

There's a difference between "art" and "craft." One is pretty much useless without the other. Rhetorical gave you good advice on "craft." That's one way to learn it. Give it a go...and see if "art" follows along. :)

Re: rhetorical, Ryan...if you would be so kind....
 

Totally unrelated to the thread, but Morgan, read this comic and the next 2-3, you might have a chuckles ;)

http://www.pvponline.com/archive.php3?archive=20060105

Re: rhetorical, Ryan...if you would be so kind....
 

:bustingup

Thank you so very much, DrGuile!! That did, in fact, cause a great big chuckle. Always appreciated! :okthumb:

Re: rhetorical, Ryan...if you would be so kind....
 

Personally, I hate writing. But it certainly sells. I have never been interested in the art of it, but I have never considered my writing craft either. I consider the craft as gaining a sign up because of what I write.
Its like photography. There is very little art in porn photography, but a fair bit of craft. Where porn really falls apart is in video. So few can actually do it well.
I wish I was interested in writing because it certainly is a good way to make a living. I have written tons of copy for broadcast but it bores me silly, so I gave it up.
But all of the above, is good advice, MG.

Re: rhetorical, Ryan...if you would be so kind....
 

Thank you, rhetorical. :)

I'm a writer who fell into porn. I love writing. All kinds of writing, even the "hardcore fuck stories" I do. (I can't in good conscience call them "erotica." D.H. Lawrence writes "erotica." I write hardcore fuck stories for the internet.)

I'd much rather be working on a novel. However, earning a living doth call...and this writer mutters grimly and forges ahead with whatever porn project is on the table.

I do agree that a true craft is constructing sentences, i.e. text links or descriptive banner text, that makes a surfer click and go sign up. That takes a great deal of effort and experience to do correctly. It's very easy to do wrong, though, as a cursory glance around at some porn sites will prove.

Re: rhetorical, Ryan...if you would be so kind....
 

Lots of great advice in here :okthumb: :okthumb: Thanks Morgan, its good to see you again too! Hope you had a great New Year & Holiday season! :)

Re: rhetorical, Ryan...if you would be so kind....
 

Copywriting is one the most overlooked facets of websites, both porn and straight. I find that because the internet made distribution of product so easy, it was quickly populated by "amateurs", and I mean that in its most disparaging context. Their spelling and general language comprehension skills were/are so rudimentary that at times it is hard to even figure out the pitch. Creativity in marketing is hitting an all time low on the internet. Sometimes I wonder what happened to public education. I am not the most literate of souls but what I see "graduating" from high school today makes me cringe.
The good news is, however, that if you can spell, write, and have a modicum of creativity and intuition, you can stand out in a crowd and make money. So many flog so many dead horses because they just can't get beyond the obvious. I keep reading how there is nothing new to sell in porn. The heady days are over. That is a crock. The days of easy ideas sold with bad copy, bad pictures, by rank amateurs is over. Glitzy design doesn't sell. Good content sells.

Re: rhetorical, Ryan...if you would be so kind....
 

Thanks Morgan ... Wow i have got more business related advice here the last week then... Well, in a while. It could have to do with the fact I am taking business more seriously.. but none the less - It's nice :)

Morgan would of helped me anyways because she is just one of the coolest, sweetest, and most kind people I have met. But I have also seen snippets of advice here and there that have been very helpful

Re: rhetorical, Ryan...if you would be so kind....
 

:blush:

I've got the lad totally fooled. I'm really just after phone sex with him! :yowsa:

Hi, Sin! :waving: Had an absolutely wonderful holiday season...but - per usual - I am SO glad they're over with! I'm packing to move now, which is physically killing me, but exciting. I've never picked up more objects and muttered "what *is* this and why do we own it?" in my life. :blink:

You are very literate, and depending upon where you are currently standing, a Rhodes Scholar equivalent. They lowered the standards and kept lowering them in public education. I remember my mother looking at me and saying "What do you mean, you've never read Moby Dick?!?!?!?" (She was a graduate of Cathedral High School in Springfield, MA, which means her high school education was most likely the equivalent of a Master's Degree today.) By the time my children were in high school, I was reduced to "what do you mean they never taught you to diagram a sentence?!?!?!?!?" To this day, my youngest says "oh, I got a great education...but I got it at home."

I've tried reading Moby Dick, for my mother's sake. I can't get past page 119, no matter how hard I try. Seven pages explaining why the damned whale was frightening because it was white. I counted. Seven damned pages explaining why white was frightening. Oh, for heaven's sake....

Re: rhetorical, Ryan...if you would be so kind....
 

You are very literate, and depending upon where you are currently standing, a Rhodes Scholar equivalent.

I used to have sex with a Rhodes scholar. The dirtiest girl I ever had the pleasure of....well, you don't really want to know. Does that count?

Re: rhetorical, Ryan...if you would be so kind....
 

Yes, it counts...although I'm not quite certain for what.... :blink:

It does prove that intelligent women do it better, something I publicly support with my "Fuck Me...I Have a High I.Q." t-shirt. ;)

By the way, if you don't want to quote the post to which you are responding, in the response box you will see a line of icons. The one on the bottom row, far right, will put the quote tags in place for you if you click on it. Then you can copy/paste the line you want to quote between the tags. (You can also just click "quote" on the entire post and delete everything except the line to which you are responding.)

Just me bein' helpful. :)

Re: rhetorical, Ryan...if you would be so kind....
 

Intelligent women have better imaginations.

Re: rhetorical, Ryan...if you would be so kind....
 

Truer words were never spoken! :yowsa:

Re: rhetorical, Ryan...if you would be so kind....
 

Our parents read. Our grandparents read. That was their primary way to absorb information about that which they may not have been able to experience. Times have changed. We have many, many more ways of absorbing info, from documentaries, radio, television, and getting on a plane and experiencing that which they could only read about. Now along comes the internet and whatdayaknow? Kids have to read again, but much more succinctly. They can answer any question you like in under five minutes with a high speed terminal. You don't need to "know" as much, you just have to know where to find it. That leads to another problem. Spelling. If you can't spell it, you can't find it (well, certainly not as quickly). It is an evolutionary process. Our penmanship sucks, but we type 130 wpm, so who needs a pen.
We have email, so long letters have become less necessary. We can squirt off a couple of paragraphs three or four times a day. It is a different style of intercourse, but it certainly is effective and useful

What we have lost is elegance, and I see no hope of regaining that in the future. It is lost to the common man.

Re: rhetorical, Ryan...if you would be so kind....
 

In fact I would take it one step further. If you can spell and write coherently on webmaster boards, it is an impediment. The majority seems to think that is vain. I have never understood equating grammar with conceit. Damn, just because you speak English good, certainly doesn't mean you speak good English.

Re: rhetorical, Ryan...if you would be so kind....
 

Are you deliberately attempting to seduce me, or is this just a lucky by-product? :blink:

Back in the beginning of my career on the internet, whenever someone would attempt to explain something technical to me, I took to whining "I write with a fountain pen! I don't understand any of this!"

During a recent period of "taking back my own life" I resumed the long habit I once had of handwriting letters. I still prefer them. I like things I can touch. I like knowing that the recipient knows I went to the trouble of handwriting it, that I held it in my own hands. I fuss with stationary, note cards, stickers for the envelopes and select just the right stamps. Quaint, archaic...and very emotionally fulfilling. I use e-mail and frequently send e-cards, but...they're just not the same.

One of the "banner days" of my life as a parent was the day we sat down with the Encyclopedia Brittanica saleswoman and paid heavily for a *brand new, up-to-date* set. This was pre-internet and my children didn't quite understand why Mommy was in tears over the whole thing. It meant the world to me, that MY kids had a brand new set...at home.

I still prefer books to television. I don't knock the internet as an information source. But you do have to be able to read and spell to use it. (There is a search engine that enquires "do you mean this?" when you search for something and nothing comes up, though. I don't know whether to be happy about that or not.)