Marvelous Mark is still too much (2much.net)

[sarettah]

Still up to the old shenanigans I see.

http://www.gofuckyourself.com/showthread.php?t=939022

LCN / LiveCam Network / 2Much.net ***WARNING***

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I just wanted to warn people on this board about the business practices of LCN / Live Cam Network / 2Much.net. Let me share my wonderful experience with you:

- Early last year I was looking for a private label webcam solution for my site, and found what looked like true HD streaming. It carried a big pricetag, a $6000 license fee, but I decided to try it, since I thought the quality was better than average.

- Their system is designed for us to recruit models, and provide traffic, and our models will then be shared with other sites on their network.

- During that year, there were numerous botched upgrades which resulted in downtime of as much as 1 week for my site. The final "upgrade" reduced the quality of the stream substantially, as it went from a Flash Media Encoder to just a regular Flash Player plugin.

- They also claimed that my site had a lot of fraud transactions, yet they advertised that they have the best anti fraud solution, which I was required to pay for $75/month. This is on top of the already high hosting fee of $125. Yes, they charged me to host a site that promoted their models.

- Finally, I was told to get my own merchant account, so I would not be on theirs. This I did as well. Their "techs" charged me $85 for the change, and my site was down for a week.

- To make a long story short, after 1 year of losing money, and paying LCN a small fortune, I decided to switch back ends to a much larger and well known company that had more realistic business practices.

- Since I already spent $6,000 on their license, I decided to move my primary domain away from them, and put another, smaller domain on their network to keep for models that were used to working on this site.

- Once Mark Prince, the owner of LCN found out I am changing domains (this was my damn domain to begin with), he threw a fit, and gave me some song and dance about how I am not allowed to switch the DNS on my own domain, blah blah blah.

- Keep in mind that at this point, he still owed me money for 4 months, while I dutifully paid his fees of course.

Now ladies and gentlemen, here's the kicker!!! Of course I am going to leave, what does he think I am a charity, here to support his sorry ass operation? So I go and change sites, and what does he do, he emails one of our models telling her he no longer works with me, and tries to recruit her to work for him at a guaranteed hourly rate (I have the email to prove it that she sent me). Yes, you heard right! Not only did he have the balls to charge me $6,000 for a worthless license plus all those fees to promote his models and sites, he has the guts to recruit my models too.

As icing on the cake, I just got notice that the last payment of $1,700 that I received from LCN bounced. So that put the balance they owe me at over $10,000.

Well, you know what they say, fool me once shame on you, fool me twice... Sorry for the rant, but I just wanted to prevent others from making the costly mistake that I made. So if you do business with 2Much.net, expect to pay a lot, recruit models that they will try to take for themselves, and if you leave you will not get paid a dime!

[gonzo]

WOW

:waving:

[Toby]

Same old song, new verse. :rolleyes:

[softball]

Mark, is any of this true?

[2muchmark2]

No, he's way off.

I posted my reply on GFY already in the same thread, but I'm unable to copy/paste it here because I have URL's in the post with screenshots, etc.

I will ask Greg / Mediaguy to do it.

[Mediaguy]

*sigh*

http://www.gfy.com/showthread.php?p=16560386&posted=1#post16560386

Hello PornsiteNewBie

It is unfortunate that you have chosen to express your negative experience with us here on GFY, however since you have done so perhaps others may assist you in understanding why our business together had to end. Your post includes many errors which I am happy to address below.


- Their system is designed for us to recruit models, and provide traffic, and our models will then be shared with other sites on their network.


No, this is not true. Your website was never down. Only MBASE was unavailable, and it was unavailable for 3 days between August 18th and August 21. Our big upgrade this year was to LiveCamNetwork 3.0. In the NEWS area of our administrator program, we announced the beginning of the upgrades on August 18th 2009. (Please seen the screenshot below):


http://www.2much.net/gfy/news-1.jpg

Your website was upgraded on August 21st, and then tested and "signed off" on August 22nd. During this time, your website remained online and active. Only MBASE was disabled (it was required for the update) which is why you saw less traffic. We had warned you that Mbase would be disabled in advance of the upgrade. (The news area by the way, is the first page everyone who logs into our administrator program sees).



- They also claimed that my site had a lot of fraud transactions, yet they advertised that they have the best anti fraud solution, which I was required to pay for $75/month. This is on top of the already high hosting fee of $125. Yes, they charged me to host a site that promoted their models.


You had an enormous amount of fraud and chargebacks on your website. If you would please check with your associate Janet, you will find out that we had alerted her several times to the high fraud rate, and then took the time to explain to her how to assist in keep the fraud down. In addition to this, Corvette from CCBill was also helping Janet to keep fraud down, to explain how it worked, and even to enable velocity checking on your account.


When someone makes a purchase and then that purchase is charged back, You are NOT paid out. This is a standard risk that all online businesses who deliver non-tangible goods take. No billing company like CCBill will take on this risk, and neither will we. 100% of the respnsibility for all fraud must all on to the merchant.

Our fraud detection system is described in more detail on our 2Much dot net site. It is an additional layer of protection to help detect fraud and keep it as low as possible. When fraud is detected or suspected, a telephone call is placed to the CARD HOLDER. If the the card holder DENIES his purchase, his card is either being used without his permission, or he is committing what is known as "friendly fraud". Regardless, this purchase is VOIDED. A Void, Refund or Chargeback is almost the same thing wherein no money is collected from the end user, and therefore no money is paid out to you.


- Finally, I was told to get my own merchant account, so I would not be on theirs. This I did as well. Their "techs" charged me $85 for the change, and my site was down for a week.


Please see this screenshot of your sub account at CCBill:

http://www.2much.net/gfy/ccbill.jpg

Out of 76 purchases, 31 of them were fraud. This high rate is unacceptable not only by us, but by CCBill as well. This is why I told you that we cannot process for you any longer, and told you that you had to get your own account. I had also warned Janet 2 weeks prior to this that if fraud was not brought under control right away that we would cancel your sub account with us and ask you to obtain your own.

To clarify the charges: We charge $125.00 per month for our customer care package which includesnot only software, but software updates (like v2.5 to 3.0 as you had received). We also charge $35.00 per month to use our sub account, and $35.00 per month to use our fraud system.



- To make a long story short, after 1 year of losing money, and paying LCN a small fortune, I decided to switch back ends to a much larger and well known company that had more realistic business practices.


I am sorry that you think that our business practices are unrealistic.



- Since I already spent $6,000 on their license, I decided to move my primary domain away from them, and put another, smaller domain on their network to keep for models that were used to working on this site.
- Once Mark Prince, the owner of LCN found out I am changing domains (this was my damn domain to begin with), he threw a fit, and gave me some song and dance about how I am not allowed to switch the DNS on my own domain, blah blah blah.


What you did was violate our Terms of Service Agreement, and make a bad situation even worse. By switching your DNS away, you have denied all of your customers (See the CCBill screenshot above) the ability to use your website. And since this was our sub account, you have transfered all of this damage to us. You are "not allowed" to change your DNS away for this reason. In our (which you signed), we have this line:

6.06.01 In the event that the Licensee makes use of Licensor's billing sub-account facility, Licensee shall always maintain its domain name pointed to the domain name server (or "D.N.S.") as specifically designated by Licensor, and shall not switch or point its domain to any other domain name server unless Licensor has provided prior written authorization to do so; failure to respect this provision will cause Licensee to be liable for all damages caused by this default. Licensor shall be entitled to recover all losses or damages caused by any D.N.S. violation. In order to mitigate any damages that would occur from a D.N.S. violation, Licensor shall also be entitled to redirect all traffic from Licensee's domain to that of Licensor's choice, in addition to giving notice to Licensee's customers of the redirection in traffic, which will allow said customers to benefit from purchases made prior to a D.N.S. violation.



- Keep in mind that at this point, he still owed me money for 4 months, while I dutifully paid his fees of course.


Tracy has been constantly asking you to provide a signed terms of service agreement. You kept changing the name of payee from your own personal name, to someone elses name, to Janet, and then back to V Entertainment. The signer of the Terms of Service Agreement must be the same as the payee. You finally only sent a signed contract to us only a few weeks ago, at which time, your first check went out to you.


He emails one of our models telling her he no longer works with me, and tries to recruit her to work for him at a guaranteed hourly rate (I have the email to prove it that she sent me).


This is true. We had emailed her because she already had an account at LiveCamNetwork.com. Our website already pays chat models a guaranteed hourly rate plus commission. In addition, 100% of her customers were from LiveCamNetwork, and she posted very often on our BBS. Despite all of this, I think this was a mistake on my part and I did apologize to you already.



As icing on the cake, I just got notice that the last payment of $1,700 that I received from LCN bounced. So that put the balance they owe me at over $10,000.


No, you are wrong. On advice of our lawyer, a Stop Payment was placed on this check due to your violation of the Terms of Service (described above). An email was sent to you notifying you of the stop payment along with the explanation that the stop payment was necessary until such time that damages due to chargebacks could be fully assessed. A Customer has 6 months to dispute any charge on his credit card. Since you have denied access to 100% of your customers by changing your DNS, it is very possible that all of your customers in the past 6 months can chargeback their purchases. If your customers go to CCBill to chargeback those purchases, CCBill will go to your site, see that the customers username no longer works, and then grant that user his chargeback.

We are responsible for your sub account. If someone charges back their purchase, we now owe this money back to CCBill. If and when you get your own CCBill account you will understand this very quickly.


Well, you know what they say, fool me once shame on you, fool me twice... Sorry for the rant, but I just wanted to prevent others from making the costly mistake that I made. So if you do business with 2Much, expect to pay a lot, recruit models that they will try to take for themselves, and if you leave you will not get paid a dime!



I am sorry that you had to learn the hard way about the true realities of doing business online. I sincerely hope that you read my post carefully and learn anything you can from it.

[2muchmark2]

btw: Gonzo:

Thanks for letting us post our side of the story.

[gonzo]

btw: Gonzo:

Thanks for letting us post our side of the story.
Honestly Mark I think your a decent guy.
Ive recommended your product because it is the best thing on the market.
But after seeing a few of your customer complain... maybe in your enthusiastic sales presentation these clients set their own level of expectation too high?
The guy is pissed after making a 10K investment... but damn 2/3rds bad processing speaks for itself.
Ive never seen that many voids on top of everything else in a CCBill panel.
3K revenue and 2K of it was shit.
That aint your fault.

[softball]

I agree with Gonzo on this one. Something this guy did was way wrong.

[2muchmark2]

Honestly Mark I think your a decent guy.
Ive recommended your product because it is the best thing on the market.
But after seeing a few of your customer complain... maybe in your enthusiastic sales presentation these clients set their own level of expectation too high?
The guy is pissed after making a 10K investment... but damn 2/3rds bad processing speaks for itself.
Ive never seen that many voids on top of everything else in a CCBill panel.
3K revenue and 2K of it was shit.
That aint your fault.

Unfortunately, many of our customers are newbies. They think that if they buy our software, they are buying their way into the "world of porn". They see Million dollar sales surrounded by lots of girls. They don't understand how much real work is involved these days. We offer tons of support and a BBS where everyone can talk with everyone else to exchange ideas etc, but ...

To be 100% honest, our versions previous to 3.0 were bad. They worked, but they required Windows Media, Java, Ports, special security settings etc etc. And even though we provided endless detailed instructions and lots of hand-holding support, many newbie webmasters simply followed the tune in their own brains instead.

[JFK]

I agree with Gonzo on this one. Something this guy did was way wrong.

yeah , look at those CB's:yowsa:

[pornlaw]

To be 100% honest, our versions previous to 3.0 were bad. They worked, but they required Windows Media, Java, Ports, special security settings etc etc.

Quoted for truth....