Visa Wakes Up Sleep Sites?

[RawAlex]

Rumor has it that Visa is removing "sleep sex" style sites from processing.

Anyone have any more on that?

[Cleo]

Personally I've always considered these sites rape sites and refused to promote them or list them.

But this is the first I've heard about the Visa stance on them, good for Visa.

[EmporerEJ]

Personally I've always considered these sites rape sites and refused to promote them or list them.

But this is the first I've heard about the Visa stance on them, good for Visa.

While I agree these sites are garbage, and I want nothing to do with them, I can't agree with your "Good For Visa" stance.

I don't need a credit card processor, with a defacto monopoly, making value judgments, good OR bad about how I spend my money.

That is a very dangerous slope.

[Cleo]

I just think Visa sees them for what they are, rape sites.

Visa doesn't process snuff, rape and other non consensual type stuff.

[EmporerEJ]

I just think Visa sees them for what they are, rape sites.

Visa doesn't process snuff, rape and other non consensual type stuff.

Yes, I understand, and I think you are missing my point.

My problem is with Visa/MC/AMEX/ or Discover making a "value" judgment on what is right and wrong. I don't need a "nanny bank" in addition to a "nanny state" or a "Nanny health care system."

I'm all "growed up" now, and can make my own decisions.

Today it's "simulate rape," and tomorrow, it's simulated flogging.
Next year, it's "plain jane" sex.

Case in point....how about this fine new release:
http://www.avn.com/movies/84035.html?utm_source=avndaily&utm_medium=email&utm_content=image&utm_campaign=movie_review

Now, is vivid's new video "too far" for visa? Sure sounds like those women have some "rough" ideas......
I sure hope my credit card company protects me from aggressive females.

(I'm intentionally being a "bit over the top.")

[Cleo]

I get what you are saying about Visa playing the role of censorship.

I just have always had a real problem with sleep sites.

As far as the videos of people beating each other all the ones I've seen have had scenes in them showing that it was consensual rough sex.

[DannyCox]

I also don't like the idea of Visa et al doing any sort of censoring. It really isn't there place to take a moral stance on what consumers may want. If it is legal, it should be fine with them! Sleep Sites are all fantasy things, as we all know, and the premise is just silly. I don't even mind simulated rape scenes, hell, there's enough of those on regular TV already!

[Cleo]

I the TV simulated rape scenes aren't meant to sexual excite and get people off.

[RawAlex]

I also don't like the idea of Visa et al doing any sort of censoring. It really isn't there place to take a moral stance on what consumers may want. If it is legal, it should be fine with them! Sleep Sites are all fantasy things, as we all know, and the premise is just silly. I don't even mind simulated rape scenes, hell, there's enough of those on regular TV already!

Actually Danny, I would say that the material in most of these sites, if sent by mail interstate in the US, would be enough to get the sender charged with obscenity.

http://www.usdoj.gov/usao/txn/PressRel06/gartman_mcdowell_sen_pr.html

You would probably remember this guy, his site was called FORBIDDENVIDEOS.COM, and he sold the tapes via the mail. His little disclaimer was that he had model releases for all of them, and that they were not "rape", just a fantasy.

It's clear that the DoJ and the courts didn't buy it.

[tony404]

man those memory foam bed people are fucked. lol

[EmporerEJ]

I the TV simulated rape scenes aren't meant to sexual excite and get people off.

You're joking, right?
No, you're right....it's just supposed to make people feel good enough to buy the product coming up in 3.....2......1.....<Commercial>>

Yea...you're right.

[TheEnforcer]

I see both sides of the argument but can't say I'm surprised Visa did it....

[Evil Chris]

Actually Danny, I would say that the material in most of these sites, if sent by mail interstate in the US, would be enough to get the sender charged with obscenity.

http://www.usdoj.gov/usao/txn/PressRel06/gartman_mcdowell_sen_pr.html

You would probably remember this guy, his site was called FORBIDDENVIDEOS.COM, and he sold the tapes via the mail. His little disclaimer was that he had model releases for all of them, and that they were not "rape", just a fantasy.

It's clear that the DoJ and the courts didn't buy it.I'd say rape AND torture is a far cry from sleep sites, and this sort of thing seems to be handled on a case to case basis.

[EmporerEJ]

I see both sides of the argument but can't say I'm surprised Visa did it....

No, especially since they announced they were going to "control" the adult industry about 10 years ago.

[Hell Puppy]

Visa pushing into this type of arena with their decisions of what's obscene is scary to me.

Sleep sites CAN be in the same genre as a rape site. But pics of passed out drunk girlfriends? That's voyeur fantasy, not rape fantasy....

Oh, and most states have peeping tom laws, so do we smoke all hidden camera sites too?

[tony404]

Visa pushing into this type of arena with their decisions of what's obscene is scary to me.

Sleep sites CAN be in the same genre as a rape site. But pics of passed out drunk girlfriends? That's voyeur fantasy, not rape fantasy....

Oh, and most states have peeping tom laws, so do we smoke all hidden camera sites too?

its better than they stop processing adult totally. Where do you draw the line with fantasy?

[housekeeper]

I honestly didn't know what this was until yesterday, one of the programs I belong to promotes a sleep-sex site, and I remembered this thread. Guys on swingers sites and user groups post pics of their sleeping wives, I don't really dig that, but as a poster pointed out, how can you moderate someones fantasy...

[Cleo]

Guys on swingers sites and user groups post pics of their sleeping wives, I don't really dig that, but as a poster pointed out, how can you moderate someones fantasy...
No, we are talking about sites where the guy has sex with an unconscious woman that is supposed to be sleeping.

[Hell Puppy]

its better than they stop processing adult totally. Where do you draw the line with fantasy?

You're asking wrong person.

If it were me, I *dont* draw the line. Anything between two consenting adults is fine by me. And if someone else is offended by it, dont watch it.

But no one is ever going to appoint me emperor. So my reality is let someone else push the edge of the envelope.

This one just bothers me because if they start to whittle at anything non-consentual whether fantasy or "play" or not, then there's a lot of niches that could potentially fall....

[TheEnforcer]

No, especially since they announced they were going to "control" the adult industry about 10 years ago.

Well, in all honesty, VISA isn't the government and I don't think it's wrong for a biz like Visa to have a reasonable say over what their business supports.

[housekeeper]

No, we are talking about sites where the guy has sex with an unconscious woman that is supposed to be sleeping.
Straight porn has changed a lot since I stopped watching it...