Gfy???

[voodooman]

This place has taken on a new look. Alot like GFY with all the huge sigs and stuff.

Nick, Come back.

;)

[Sin]

I miss nick, but Gonzo & JoesHO are doing a decent job from what I can tell. Granted I also haven't had much time to pay any real attention to the boards lately.

I do miss Nick though, and Newton & Trev.

[gonzo]

This place has taken on a new look. Alot like GFY with all the huge sigs and stuff.

Nick, Come back.

;)

What is it you do in the business again?

[Winetalk.com]

What is it you do in the business again?


:)

Voodoo, say touche!
:)

[voodooman]

What is it you do in the business again?

Eat Donuts.

Got a problem with that?

[voodooman]

:)

Voodoo, say touche!
:)

Serge,

Douche.;)

[Winetalk.com]

"Oklahoma, Oklahoma..."

http://www.dalelauner.com/MoviePictures/MonkeyBoy.jpg

[Hell Puppy]

This place has taken on a new look. Alot like GFY with all the huge sigs and stuff.

Nick, Come back.

;)

I like Nick, he's a funny guy.

But Oprano is at it's best when it's a bit of a water cooler.

I'm sure if you asked GonZo nicely though he could probably create a folder on here where there's nothing but paid posters who are not currently active in the biz saying good morning to each other and asking if people got their child-sized hat yet.

[gonzo]

I like Nick, he's a funny guy.

But Oprano is at it's best when it's a bit of a water cooler.

I'm sure if you asked GonZo nicely though he could probably create a folder on here where there's nothing but paid posters who are not currently active in the biz saying good morning to each other and asking if people got their child-sized hat yet.

Hell no that costs $500 a month and comes with multiple excuses of my DSL was down again.

[Hell Puppy]

Hell no that costs $500 a month and comes with multiple excuses of my DSL was down again.

Yeah, but you've got an extra room.

[gonzo]

Yeah, but you've got an extra room.

I dont have that big of a long distance budget.

[JoesHO]

your soooo right voodooman.....
paid posters, and chinese fake alexa stats were so much better

Than actual people in the industry trying to promote their wares.
How unthoughtful of us to actually want business and industry people to come here .

[JoesHO]

I mean, hell adult is dead anyway, right ? wasn't that the old mantra and discussions?

I mean it is only a 12.5 BILLION dollar ( taxes receipt confirmed) industry.
and since that is only on the verifiable income made ( not like models are ever paid cash or anything and everyone is always 100% acurate on their year end reporting) and since this is just in the USA and porn is worldwide business. I would say a reasonable $20 BILLION dollar industry ( and growing ) is just a stupid thiing to talk about and a waste of tyime .

I mean all the smart people left the industy already , right ?
So why do something as foolish as allow/try to encourage people to talk about such a shitty industry anymore .

We should actually ban sigs and talk about the good old days when the web was wild, and no oversite exsisted, and money was for the taking . those millions were made by everyone !

The BILLIONS now, are just a fake figure cause the new people with the morals that have no idea what they are doing in the industry , are just saying they make that much in order to contribute MORE to the less fortunate people of the world since all the tax cuts in the USA make them feel bad, they wanted to contribute more each year , huh ?

you want comedy and talk shows about mainstream, just turn on the old TV , if you want to learn new people and new ideas or companys in the ADULT world then come to an ADULT board.

P.S. how much for you to fly my sig each month ?

[Vick]

Hmmmmm

As one from the old school

You shouldn't be so quick to piss on Nick, he carried the ball (with Gonzo assisting for a while) and it was what is was
Overall it was a pretty damn good job, even if it did get a little bit to the tea and crumpets side. There was still good business minds, maybe not as focused on adult as there are greener pastures

(I think) it's too early to fairly access where Oprano is headed, it is easy to say there is more business but just a very small amount of GFY type banter

As for where the entire industry is and is going the dollar figures, yes there is more $ but the pie is sliced into more pieces as well

In the early years it wasn't rocket science to walk out with a mil a year or more, Now my guess is it's rather challenging for website operators to do 250,000+ a year

As long as the barrier to entry is low and mom and pops and college students are happy making a few hundred a month it will be challenging to fully monetize

Many people in this business couldn't market a cure to cancer to an oncology lab,
KK said years ago one of the problems in this business were those who are more concerned with seeing their counters spin iinstead of being concerned with seeing their bank accounts grow

All anyone had to do was study new market economies
I didn't until it was too late

[JoesHO]

Hmmmmm

As one from the old school

You shouldn't be so quick to piss on Nick, he carried the ball (with Gonzo assisting for a while) and it was what is was
Overall it was a pretty damn good job, even if it did get a little bit to the tea and crumpets side. There was still good business minds, maybe not as focused on adult as there are greener pastures

(I think) it's too early to fairly access where Oprano is headed, it is easy to say there is more business but just a very small amount of GFY type banter

As for where the entire industry is and is going the dollar figures, yes there is more $ but the pie is sliced into more pieces as well

In the early years it wasn't rocket science to walk out with a mil a year or more, Now my guess is it's rather challenging for website operators to do 250,000+ a year

As long as the barrier to entry is low and mom and pops and college students are happy making a few hundred a month it will be challenging to fully monetize

Many people in this business couldn't market a cure to cancer to an oncology lab,
KK said years ago one of the problems in this business were those who are more concerned with seeing their counters spin iinstead of being concerned with seeing their bank accounts grow

All anyone had to do was study new market economies
I didn't until it was too late


I am not pissing on Nick in any way shape or form.
I am saying that while he had it, it went a different direction . That apperantly was not as profitable as one might hope .

Let me clear on this ...

WHO GIVES A FUCK WHAT WAS ? THE TIME FOR GROWTH AND OPPORTUNITY IS IN THE FUTURE NOT THE PAST .

wisdom can be learned from the past, but when the sands change the landscape the dinasours and old guard in history never are the future of the industry .

Some will go donw in the hall of fame , others will go down in the archives of what not to do ..... but the fact is NEW BLOOD will always determine the future.

and if someone does not like what is happening here , new or old there is always another bar down the corner, feel free to take a chair there .

[Hell Puppy]

It's about community.

The theme, or make up of the community can be anything as long as there's a shared interest or something that all of the members have in common. There is room for several adult industry communities.

Oprano in the past has been the home of the old guard. Even those who have not been in the industry for 8+ years who gather here are typically more mature, a bit older, a bit more seasoned in business in general. This is also what has made it a bit tough on newbies here. They have to gain some respect before they truly fit in.

Now bring in some paid posters and start generating threads and messages just for the sake of increasing message count and clutter up the message base with inanities from people that the core audience has ZERO respect for, and you basically run your existing community off. I have no idea what the previous management was thinking, maybe they honestly thought you can build a community full of people's whose interest is free hats and mugs.

Dunno, but it didn't work....the board was frankly unreadable.

Nothing personal against Nick....he tried something, it didn't work, he cut bait. No big deal.

Joe and GonZo will try something different. Might work, might not. Time will tell. But so far, the board seems more vibrant than it did a month ago.

[Winetalk.com]

Nick had no time for Oprano -
he was busy making money for webmasters and fighting scammers!

live testimony:

http://www.gofuckyourself.com/showthread.php?p=9161634&posted=1#post9161634

[Vick]

and if someone does not like what is happening here , new or old there is always another bar down the corner, feel free to take a chair there .

Is that an invitation for me to GFY? ;-)

and old ass dinosaurs like myself have an awful lot of business acumen
How do you think we lasted so long ;-)

[Vick]

Looks like I broke trying to post this before but I'll try again


While we're around the subject of business I'll pontificate on the business model that's got my attention lately

My Space - a lot of people are talking about it, it's gotten huge word of mouth exposure,
one of the beauties is that it is viral, user A builds a page, user B has to become a member to read user A's blog and wants to post back to user A's page and then builds their own page and so on to user C,D,E, F and so on and so on

and what it is really is more reality TV, write about yourself so the world can read and give you props?

But it's working and it's huge

So I look at how to monetize and see just one ad on every page, then I think if your showing that one ad millions of times a day that becomes pretty powerful

Advertising makes the world go round, I'd say a few years back the internet lost the ability to deliver R.O.I. and started selling branding (I spent 14 months with a large internet advertising concern so I have a little first hand experience)


Once again we've taken the worlds most powerful information medium and made a flea market of it ....

... and who cares as long as there is $$$$ to be made

Now if I can just come up with the next big thing and be there first ;-)

Hmmm I need reality, vanity junk that is viral

[JoesHO]

Vick, that is what Xpeeps is . www.xpeeps.com check it out .

[Vick]

While Xpeeps can be a valid revenue stream it limits it's self by catering to the adult only crowd so it can't get mainstream advertising

Solid idea but not where the biggest $ will be

and ....
Fake
http://www.xpeeps.com/member.php?u=8439
I bought content of this girl years ago

[gonzo]

While Xpeeps can be a valid revenue stream it limits it's self by catering to the adult only crowd so it can't get mainstream advertising

Solid idea but not where the biggest $ will be

and ....
Fake
http://www.xpeeps.com/member.php?u=8439
I bought content of this girl years ago

Only thing limiting xpeeps is keeping up with the ever growing server demand.

Admit it Vick youd give both your nuts for a site like that. I know Lens would and so would I!

[JoesHO]

While Xpeeps can be a valid revenue stream it limits it's self by catering to the adult only crowd so it can't get mainstream advertising

Solid idea but not where the biggest $ will be

and ....
Fake
http://www.xpeeps.com/member.php?u=8439
I bought content of this girl years ago

you're so right Vick, why dont more people listen to you, we should just all kill ourselves now what is the use anyway ?

By the way ( you think myspace has no fakes? )

xpeeps only been around three weeks or so now ... but what would they know anyway those rookies, they need a successful dinasour like you to enlighten them, why not go on there and teach them . share the love .

:wnw:

[Biggy]

xpeeps is a wonderful idea.. they are carving a niche with respect to those networking sites.. it will make a ton of money, will it make as much as myspace or facebook, no - but those sites today would be 100x harder if not more to replicate since they are already created and successful. xpeeps is the first of its kind to hit the adult community.

its fucking fantastic. people are getting addicted to it, according to alexa it has a very high traffic rank with respect to its niche, which indicates people are browsing DEEP into it. very nice stuff...

[Hell Puppy]

Only thing limiting xpeeps is keeping up with the ever growing server demand.

Admit it Vick youd give both your nuts for a site like that. I know Lens would and so would I!

Maybe the boys will stop by and tell us a bit more about Xpeeps, and Vick can give 'em The Shemp welcome...

[fusionx]

While Xpeeps can be a valid revenue stream it limits it's self by catering to the adult only crowd so it can't get mainstream advertising

Solid idea but not where the biggest $ will be

and ....
Fake
http://www.xpeeps.com/member.php?u=8439
I bought content of this girl years ago

How do you define mainstream? Toys'R'Us? Would you consider HBO mainstream? How about FHM, Maxim or Savvy?

What's the use of pointing out a fake? Of course there will be fakes. Any self-publishing site will have fakes, in adult, mainstream, anything.

What's much more inportant is that these are real:

http://www.xpeeps.com/realjanine

http://www.xpeeps.com/member.php?u=5755 (Missy Monroe)

http://www.xpeeps.com/member.php?u=10246 (Lisa Sparxxx)

http://www.xpeeps.com/member.php?u=2417 (Kylie Ireland)

http://www.xpeeps.com/member.php?u=11507 (Flower Tucci)

http://www.xpeeps.com/member.php?u=14385 (Austyn Moore)

and many others.

Further, why wouldn't we go after the adult only crowd? There's already a major player in the other spaces.. it's called myspace. Since this is an adult board, and since we are talking about the adult biz, what's your point?

[Jace]

While Xpeeps can be a valid revenue stream it limits it's self by catering to the adult only crowd so it can't get mainstream advertising

Solid idea but not where the biggest $ will be


cause we all know that if you build a site and only seek adult revenue, the money just isn't there?

i am lost here, since when is it a bad idea to generate adults only income? last I checked porn sites were profitable

[JoesHO]

I am getting good business from Xpeeps already :okthumb:
so just keep them old crotchety fuckers away will ya Vick, those young bucks are too stupid to know how to get any of the $12.5 taxed money made off of porn.

[Vick]

I'm saying there are bigger fish than adult

Yes money is in adult but at this time it seems there is bigger money in mainstream

and to turn your nose up at mainstream and only look for adult money severly limits your income

So it Oprano an adult board or a money board?

Or maybe just maybe an adult board concerned about money

[Vick]

and I've said Xpeeps is a solid idea

and I'm also saying myspace will make more revenue

[Vick]

cause we all know that if you build a site and only seek adult revenue, the money just isn't there?

i am lost here, since when is it a bad idea to generate adults only income? last I checked porn sites were profitable


Is porn all you can do?

is there money in other arenas, possibly bigger money?

[Vick]

Maybe the boys will stop by and tell us a bit more about Xpeeps, and Vick can give 'em The Shemp welcome...

You'll never let me forget will ya ;-)
Maybe he should have had a little thicker skin
or did you all want to grovel up to him for a little shit traffic and call it networking or learning or whatever


and there is a huge difference between what Xpeeps does and Shemps business model

[JoesHO]

what area of mainstream , vick just mainstream vs Porn of course mainstream is bigger .

tell us a mainstram avenue that is as profitable as porn with as little needed to get into it .

[fusionx]

and I've said Xpeeps is a solid idea

and I'm also saying myspace will make more revenue

and I'm still trying to find a point.

It's patently obvious that myspace will make more money. It's so obvious that bringing it up is rather absurd.

Big studio films make more than indies. Should indies quit making movies?

Should Evil Angel or DVSX shoot Lord of the Rings? LoTR will make a lot more money.

Microsoft makes more than De Beers. Should De Beers create an operating system?

It's a big world with big markets. Find a niche that's makes you comfortable and run with it. Don't always try to find the biggest thing possible - you're setting yourself up for failure.

[Vick]

what area of mainstream , vick just mainstream vs Porn of course mainstream is bigger .

tell us a mainstram avenue that is as profitable as porn with as little needed to get into it .

Joe that is what my little mind is turing around on now, like I said, reality, brag and viral

What would have the start up costs on myspace have been? Programming, graphis and server space. It could have been brought in for less than 5K, add a few sales guys for advertising and it's still a low barrier to entry

Look at it this way, we'll invest money into stocks and bonds and won't consider anything outside of porn?

Advertising is where it's at, get the eyes with someone else's efforts and sell the ads

[Vick]

and I'm still trying to find a point.

It's patently obvious that myspace will make more money. It's so obvious that bringing it up is rather absurd.

Big studio films make more than indies. Should indies quit making movies?

Should Evil Angel or DVSX shoot Lord of the Rings? LoTR will make a lot more money.

Microsoft makes more than De Beers. Should De Beers create an operating system?

It's a big world with big markets. Find a niche that's makes you comfortable and run with it. Don't always try to find the biggest thing possible - you're setting yourself up for failure.

Don't you want to make the most money?
Don't you want to be where the bigger money is?

or are you happy with a little piece of the pie
Want to live in an apartment or a 1.5Mil home?

[gonzo]

What would have the start up costs on myspace have been? Programming, graphis and server space. It could have been brought in for less than 5K, add a few sales guys for advertising and it's still a low barrier to entry

Look at it this way, we'll invest money into stocks and bonds and won't consider anything outside of porn?

Advertising is where it's at, get the eyes with someone else's efforts and sell the ads

I dont know about myspace but I can tell you that your numbers are incorrect in the cloning efforts. And its not that easy...ask Lens.

[Jace]

Is porn all you can do?

is there money in other arenas, possibly bigger money?

hell no, but if I start a company with the intention on banking from the porn myspace, I am not going to cave to mainstream money cause it might possibly be there, especially if I am already making good money from the porn side of it

[Hell Puppy]

You'll never let me forget will ya ;-)
Maybe he should have had a little thicker skin
or did you all want to grovel up to him for a little shit traffic and call it networking or learning or whatever


and there is a huge difference between what Xpeeps does and Shemps business model

No, no I wont. :cowboy:

I keep hearing about Shemp's thin skin... But here's the thing....I've met Shemp in person a handful of times, and even though he and I do not do any business together he has always been one of the kindest most gracious guys I've ever met in the industry. He'll answer questions candidly.

Hell, he came to Atlanta to visit one of his employees here and 50-75 people from all around came to meet the man. And he bought the whole crowd dinner. We're not talking Fat Burger here either, we're talking nice steakhouse.

So GonZo is after the guy for about a year to come hang out with us on Oprano. Oprano is a business board he explains. Lots of mature business type folks that Shemp should fit in very well with, and heck it would be very nice to have someone over here who made it big in the TGP era who started late. The guy is a success story a lot people could learn from and is a pretty good role model for doing business in a classy way.

So what happens? He hits the board and it was like chum in a shark tank. Was he welcomed? No, he was pounced in a manner normally reserved for drive-by spammers offering new billing solutions. I would call it attacked.

It felt like you Vick in particular wanted to take out several years worth of venom toward the whole TGP movement on him. Do we all wish there wasn't thousands of new pics and movies going up on TGPs every day, and we could milk the surfers like we did in 98? Sure.

But damn, a genuinely good guy who could've contributed some perspectives that are totally foreign to most of the regulars at the time was basically lynched as soon as he hit town.

Thin skinned? Ok, let's stick with the bar analogy, you invite someone over to your new bar and all the regulars tear him a new asshole because they dont like the shirt he's wearing the minute he walks in the door. Would you come back?

And yeah, it sticks in my craw cuz I consider a low moment in Oprano history. I was embarassed to be considered part of the "community" that day.

[Jace]

Vick, what exactly is your point? that adult business should no longer cater to just adult and open their doors to mainstream traffic as well, in the process getting rid of anything pornographic on their site, just to see if they can bring in mainstream dollars as well? even though in the few weeks they have been open have managed to carve a niche that wasn't there yet?

[gonzo]

Thin skinned? Ok, let's stick with the bar analogy, you invite someone over to your new bar and all the regulars tear him a new asshole because they dont like the shirt he's wearing the minute he walks in the door. Would you come back?

And yeah, it sticks in my craw cuz I consider a low moment in Oprano history. I was embarassed to be considered part of the "community" that day.

After reading some of the archieves Ive come to the conclusion that you dont have to even be the new guy in town.

The way Sarettah was relentlessly drawn and quartered by his own ranks up there as well.

As an aside... Shemp to this day blames me for the treatment he got here.

As he well should.

[JoesHO]

yeah call us GFy wannabes if you want vooodoooman, but those gang beat down days are fucking over ! we want ADULT business people here, and frankly dont give a fuck about someon not in the biz that wants to critic the people in the biz .

[sarettah]

yeah call us GFy wannabes if you want vooodoooman, but those gang beat down days are fucking over ! we want ADULT business people here, and frankly dont give a fuck about someon not in the biz that wants to critic the people in the biz .

:blink:

I give a shit what Voodooman thinks. He as been around a good long time. I don't know whether he has his fingers in the biz at all these days or not but his past experience makes him a valuable member of the board. Imho of course.

[JoesHO]

:blink:

I give a shit what Voodooman thinks. He as been around a good long time. I don't know whether he has his fingers in the biz at all these days or not but his past experience makes him a valuable member of the board. Imho of course.

then give him a call and talk all you want .
I bet he is even on icq maybe you guys can chat there about how shitty we are doing LOL

:)

[sarettah]

then give him a call and talk all you want .
I bet he is even on icq maybe you guys can chat there about how shitty we are doing LOL

:)


Whoa, whoa whoa there skippy....

I didn't say you guys are doing a shitty job, I didn't say I always agree with vdm.

I said I give a shit what he thinks. I will listen to his opinion and I think he is a valuable member of Oprano.

I don't think the proper response to criticism is to vote folks off the island. :okthumb:

[JoesHO]

Whoa, whoa whoa there skippy....

I didn't say you guys are doing a shitty job, I didn't say I always agree with vdm.

I said I give a shit what he thinks. I will listen to his opinion and I think he is a valuable member of Oprano.

I don't think the proper response to criticism is to vote folks off the island. :okthumb:



1.) I dont give a fuck
2.) my point is if you, him, or santa clause is not happy here then go somewhere else . but whining about it will do no good .
because at some point in time we will take it in the direction we want it to go with or without the old days involved will be up to the old days, but they will no longer call the shots , 2006 is a new year you can continue to ride, or switch cars it is completely up to you. Nobody is voting anybody off of anything. but kissing ass to get someone to post is not gonna happen any longer either . Nor is the run the newbie off cause this is our house mentality that ruled here prior either !

and if somebody wants respect from me, then they damn well better give it out . Because I do not respect my elders, I respect my betters , and from the time I been watching I been making moves and growing without any help from anyone here , and looks to me like they just stayed still. or went backwards in some peoples case . or never had anything anyway in others!

I am in the adult business, and I bought into an adult board to discuss adult business with people in the adult industry .

so as the saying goes, either lead , follow , or get the fuck out of the way.

[Sabby]

This is whats going to happen with this board:

You all are going to sit here and obsess about what is going to happen to this board.

Then you are going to argue about it.

And then you are all going to obsess some more...

Honestly, dont some of you actually have your OWN business to run? I really do wonder sometimes.


Sabby:flash:

[Jace]

This is whats going to happen with this board:

You all are going to sit here and obsess about what is going to happen to this board.

Then you are going to argue about it.

And then you are all going to obsess some more...

Honestly, dont some of you actually have your OWN business to run? I really do wonder sometimes.


Sabby:flash:

the people that OWN the board are going to talk about it a lot, after all, this IS what they make money from ;) when you own and run the board and make money doing it, that gives you every right to obsess :)

[Sabby]

the people that OWN the board are going to talk about it a lot, after all, this IS what they make money from ;) when you own and run the board and make money doing it, that gives you every right to obsess :)

I was referring to the rest of you :)


Sabby:flash:

[Jace]

I was referring to the rest of you :)


Sabby:flash:

ah, yes....I do have a business to run, luckily I learned at a very young age in business that the more things you create to be automated, the more time you have to goof off while your automated tasks make money for you

so, I actually do work 1-2 hours a day, but my tasks are always working for me.....it leaves me with a lot of fun time ;)

[Sabby]

Well... Party on then...

And anyway, I never said there was anything wrong with obsessing or arguing about what was going to happen.

I merely stated that was what was going to happen.

You guys are predictable.

Most business discussions on this board are always about the board itself.


Sabby:flash:

[Winetalk.com]

Honestly, dont some of you actually have your OWN business to run? I really do wonder sometimes.


Sabby:flash:

I don't...and I still come to shoot shit with friends. Am I wrong?
;)

[Winetalk.com]

Most business discussions on this board are always about the board itself.


Sabby:flash:

Not true...my favorite business discussion on this board is about your business ASSets!
:)

I wish it NEVER stopped!
:clapping:

[PornoDoggy]

Sad.

[NickPapageorgio]

Well... Party on then...

And anyway, I never said there was anything wrong with obsessing or arguing about what was going to happen.

I merely stated that was what was going to happen.

You guys are predictable.

Most business discussions on this board are always about the board itself.


Sabby:flash:

The only thing I obsess over is what's going to be in your avatar month in, month out. :yowsa: :wub:

[voodooman]

your soooo right voodooman.....
paid posters, and chinese fake alexa stats were so much better

Than actual people in the industry trying to promote their wares.
How unthoughtful of us to actually want business and industry people to come here .

Sarcasm will get you everywhere. ;)

I set out to prove a point with this thread, I achieved my goal. Thanks.

BTW, if anyone wants me to sig whore for them, feel free to email me with your price. :yowsa:

[voodooman]

P.S. how much for you to fly my sig each month ?

hahaha, oops, See previous post!

:okthumb:

[voodooman]

then give him a call and talk all you want .
I bet he is even on icq maybe you guys can chat there about how shitty we are doing LOL

:)

It's simply amazing. I make one post about my OPINION and, Oh wait, I fucked my freedom of speech by posting in the Nazi Webmaster Zone, sorry.

If you can Joe, please, point out where I said anything BAD about Oprano.
I challenge you to this because I didn't, nor have I ever said anything back ABOUT GFY. You merely assumed, which I'm quite sure that you are fully aware of that word and it's full meaning, that I was attacking you or Gonzo.
Don't be so quick to judge, your not G_d.

[Sabby]

LOL. Serge you bugger!! You stoled my ass!


Sabby:flash:

[Winetalk.com]

Sabby, I haven't stolen anything, I PROMOTE it, free of charge, of course!
Your ass is what we, in the trade, call
"Object of Art" and I PROMISE:
I'll only use it on this board and NEVER turn it into "public domain"!
;)

[PornoDoggy]

Sabby, I haven't stolen anything, I PROMOTE it, free of charge, of course!
Your ass is what we, in the trade, call
"Object of Art" and I PROMISE:
I'll only use it on this board and NEVER turn it into "public domain"!
;)
I thought she meant you had shipped her a mink ... :D

[Sabby]

I thought she meant you had shipped her a mink ... :D

LOL.


Sabby:flash:

[Hell Puppy]

Bottom line, if the board's informative and/or entertaining to read, those who are informed or entertained by it will hang around.

If it's not, their visits decrease until it eventually is removed from their daily habit and ultimately totally out of their consciousness.