Time of War!

[dantheman]

americans. It's true, there's a large group of people that dont like us, the way we live, the things we do, the things we like. THEY just DONT like us. We cant change that, there's no way in the world. So that said, do you think a president with this voting record is the Commander in Chief we need?
----------
Votes to Cut Defense Spending by 2% (S. Con. Res. 29, CQ Vote #49, Apr 25, 1991)

Votes to Slash Over $3 Billion from Defense (H.R. 2707, CQ Vote #182, Sep 10, 1991)

Votes to Cut $6 Billion from Defense (S. Con. Res. 106, CQ Vote #73, Apr 9, 1992)

Votes Against Military Pay Raise (S. Con. Res. 18, CQ Vote #73, Mar 24, 1993)

Kerry Introduces Plan To Cut Numerous Defense Programs:

Cut the number of Navy submarines and their crews

Reduce the number of light infantry units in the Army down to one

Reduce tactical fighter wings in the Air Force

Terminate the Navy’s coastal mine-hunting ship program

Force the retirement of no less than 60,000 members of the Armed Forces
in one year.
-----------------------------------

I just want to make SURE everyone knows what they are voting for.

I'm making this statement because of 1 reason. We're in a WAR! We need a CIC that knows this and will do something about it, because if not, then it'll be ugly I promise you.

Flame away :)

SemperFi
:salute:
http://www.fishcraze.com/images/USMC_-_Bush.jpeg

[JoesHO]

well considering how much halliburton alone milked off of us due to there pact with the insiders, I would say Kery was very responsible in forcing them to leave there share of the take in the troops hands, and then we would not need as much money....

oh yeah and there is the small matter of WE ARE THERE ON A LIE ANYWAY, AND NEEDTO GET THE FUCK OUT! our borders under this president have now become more open than they have ever been, we have 1 million illieagals a month sneaking in, how does not haveing that border protected help us stay safe?

we need to re evaluate our position, and kerry a natural leader, that has lots of leadership experience dealing wiht both war, and politicians, should be the one to do the proper job, and lose the rhetoric for facts and resultss!

[XXXPhoto]

Yup... and everyone knows that giving Haliburton a blank check is the only way to win a war... Fuck that going over there and actually fighting... REAL CIC's like to stay in the rear with the gear... Oh wait, he didn't even bother to show up for that either...

[PornoDoggy]

Uhhh ... remember '91-'93? Remember the so-called "peace dividend"?

Granted, thei information is somewhat more timely than Vietnam era controversies, but the relevance of 30 years ago is only marginally different than the relevance of 11 years ago.

[PornoDoggy]

Originally posted by JoesHO1@Aug 25 2004, 04:18 PM
oh yeah and there is the small matter of WE ARE THERE ON A LIE ANYWAY, AND NEEDTO GET THE FUCK OUT! our borders under this president have now become more open than they have ever been, we have 1 million illieagals a month sneaking in, how does not haveing that border protected help us stay safe?
No offense, but pulling out now would be even dumber than going in in the first place.

[RawAlex]

Dan, your brighter than that.

You can take almost any vote by any politician, put it out of context, and get the desired results. From about 86 to about 94 or 95, it was the "cold war is over let's get rid of all this military stuff". Many many american elected officials have similar records on these issues.

I suspect you are just parroting something you got from your last "re-elect Bush" campaign meeting.

I challenge you to take each of those points, put them in context, and show me how the republicans and democrats at the time handled those issues. Do that, and it will make much more sense.

Alex

[eatapeach]

i can definitely see why someone would be against kerry, but i can't understand how anyone could be for bush.

buff quoted this from fred reed today in another thread, but it's applicable here:
"It amounts to collusion in one's own suckering."

[Dravyk]

Originally posted by PornoDoggy@Aug 25 2004, 06:30 PM
Uhhh ... remember '91-'93? Remember the so-called "peace dividend"?
Eh, PD, you beat me to it

Give us a break, Dano! Who the hell WASN'T voting for military cutbacks at the time???

Oh, yeah, right! Dubya in '91 was too busy playing with his Harken oil wells in Quatar while Kerry was busy in office! LMAO!

I swear the Republican spin machine is so utterly transparent and vaccuous these days, it's almost sad.

... when one isn't too busy laughing! :lol:

[Diamond Jim]

Originally posted by PornoDoggy+Aug 25 2004, 04:32 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (PornoDoggy @ Aug 25 2004, 04:32 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin-JoesHO1@Aug 25 2004, 04:18 PM
oh yeah and there is the small matter of WE ARE THERE ON A LIE ANYWAY, AND NEEDTO GET THE FUCK OUT! our borders under this president have now become more open than they have ever been, we have 1 million illieagals a month sneaking in, how does not haveing that border protected help us stay safe?
No offense, but pulling out now would be even dumber than going in in the first place.[/b][/quote]
"And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death..."

Sorry, just preparing myself for the Apocalypse....

[Winetalk.com]

Originally posted by Diamond Jim@Aug 25 2004, 09:10 PM


Sorry, just preparing myself for the Apocalypse....
nice job!

http://www3.telus.net/textures/images/brando_apoc.jpg

[Vick]

Originally posted by PornoDoggy@Aug 25 2004, 04:32 PM
No offense, but pulling out now would be even dumber than going in in the first place.
That's not what she said :agrin:

[dantheman]

Originally posted by Dravyk+Aug 25 2004, 07:06 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Dravyk @ Aug 25 2004, 07:06 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-PornoDoggy@Aug 25 2004, 06:30 PM
Uhhh ... remember '91-'93? Remember the so-called "peace dividend"?
Eh, PD, you beat me to it

Give us a break, Dano! Who the hell WASN'T voting for military cutbacks at the time???

Oh, yeah, right! Dubya in '91 was too busy playing with his Harken oil wells in Quatar while Kerry was busy in office! LMAO!

I swear the Republican spin machine is so utterly transparent and vaccuous these days, it's almost sad.

... when one isn't too busy laughing! :lol: [/b][/quote]
Those that know that you HAVE to have a military that's who. The 70's showed that lesson. Reagan took care of that oversite, look how that turned out

alex, The facts are in the actions of kerry, back then, near now and now.

Guys, I just cant fathom Kerry as a PRESIDENT! His past actions(ALL OF THEM) tells ME all I need to know. That's me, and that's the cool thing about this country, we can disagree and then go have a beer, and in 4 years we can do it again:)

Semper Fi
:salute:

[Winetalk.com]

Dan,
please answer me as a former marine,
how would you feel saluting The Commander in Chief who went awol serving in National Guards?

1) With BIG salute
2) With small salute
3) Kerry never even been in Vietnam.

[PornoDoggy]

The facts, Dan? Discussing the facts would be an interesting change of pace for this election, that's for sure.

What facts disturb you, Dan? That Kerry came back like hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of returning vets) convinced that Vietnam was a clusterfuck of galactic proportions that was lost - not by the media, not by the lefties back home, and most certainly by what Patton called the "poor dumb bastards" that got sent over there - before a single fucking American boot landed in-country? That he actually had the balls to try and do something about it?

I've heard stories from plenty of people who were in-country anywhere from 1965 to 1973. Even using the utmost "sea-story" discretion (disregard outright 90% of what you are told and don't believe half of what's left), he was NOT lying in front of the Senate. That fact reflects more on the fact that the chain of command of the United States Army in particular had lost nearly complete control of the troops in 'Nam, both before (but really kicked in) after after Nixon's peace with dishonor plan (also known as Vietnamization) kicked in.

Facts? What fucking facts, Dan? Kerry went and served. All that fucking education and he wasn't smart enough to know that NAVY stands for "Never Again Volunteer Yourself." Did Bush? Did Cheney? Did Ashcroft?

[Dravyk]

Originally posted by dantheman@Aug 26 2004, 12:08 AM
That's me, and that's the cool thing about this country, we can disagree and then go have a beer, and in 4 years we can do it again:)
Totally agree with you on THIS one, Dan! :)

Looking forward to a round of beers with good friends like you. If we can figure a way to do it before January, cool; if not, then I'm holding you to it for Mandalay Bay! :stout:


Now, PD ... if you start bringing actual bona fide FACTS into this there's no sense having a campaign! :zoinks:

[JR]

It's a sad time when the world is increasingly forced to choose between American fundamentalists and Islamic fundamentalists.

[dantheman]

PD, Watch C-span tonight. Watch kerry say things to our congress that hundreds of soldiers that were captured refused to say and were tortued beyond belive for not saying them.


JR, I agree 100%

Drav, beers on me:)

Serge, As a Marine I would Salute whomever is the CIC. I was lucky, I was in the corps during reagan, one of the greatest CIC we've had in my lifetime anyhow:)

[PornoDoggy]

Dan, I've known what John Kerry said in front of Congress since shortly after he said it. Kerry didn't say anything different from what hundreds of thousands of other returning Vets were saying - he just did it in front of a larger audience.

John Kerry EARNED the right to say those things, Dan. I sure as hell hope the private who broke the prisoner abuse scandal doesn't ever plan on running for office ... he'll get called a traitor too.

So lemme see if I got this straight - you support a guy who couldn't even fulfill the responsibilities of a weekend warrior over a guy who volunteered when his country called. You cite as the greatest CinC the guy who got 200+ Marines killed in Beruit and responded by doing NOTHING, the consequences of which are still a factor in our lives.

[dantheman]

Originally posted by PornoDoggy@Aug 26 2004, 12:10 PM
Dan, I've known what John Kerry said in front of Congress since shortly after he said it. Kerry didn't say anything different from what hundreds of thousands of other returning Vets were saying - he just did it in front of a larger audience.

John Kerry EARNED the right to say those things, Dan. I sure as hell hope the private who broke the prisoner abuse scandal doesn't ever plan on running for office ... he'll get called a traitor too.

So lemme see if I got this straight - you support a guy who couldn't even fulfill the responsibilities of a weekend warrior over a guy who volunteered when his country called. You cite as the greatest CinC the guy who got 200+ Marines killed in Beruit and responded by doing NOTHING, the consequences of which are still a factor in our lives.
First of all, Out of those 200 killed from headquarters 8th marines(a company I was personally in until 3 weeks prior to deployment)I lost several GREAT friends whom I think about daily, only by luck,grace of god or whatever I wasn't in that building that day. It was sad, it was something that everyone wishes didn't happen, it was done wrong and it was corrected.

When I enter the corps in 1981 most of the military(not only the MC)was in a very bad way, the 70's consisted of cuts, downsizing, general disregard of the military by those in power. Reagan came in and just about overnight started doing things that improved our lives, moral that was very bad started to turn around, more money for training started coming in, we were issued newer equipment, mars gear(this makes training about as real as you can) was issued and used for the first time. The older nco's whom for years lived in downright demoralizing conditions for the 70's starting to come around and enjoy their careers again, We got the first pay RAISE in YEARS. Nco's instead of getting out were staying in to train us newbies. In the 70's everyone was getting out in record numbers, for a military to be great you have to have older experienced nco's and officers staying and training. That started to happen in Reagan's time in office. He made our ONCE proud Military PROUD again. We all had his picture in our rooms and would salute him every morning. WE were there, we saw what he did for us and we respected him greatly. HE was the BEST CIC of MY time. I'm VERY proud to have served for him. :)

I'm always going to support those that support the Military, I know what's it's like to have someone in office that CARES and supports you, and I've seen the way it is when it's not there. And that's NOT good for national security

Anyhow, you all know where I stand. :)

SemperFI
:salute:

*sorry to get so long winded and for any misspells:)