Why are most TGP guys such whores...

[JoesHO]

Say Shemp for example... and why do they feel they are so important, I mean be for real, the business model is necassary, But once you build all the traffic up, from them, why keep shooting yourself in the foot like some of theses guys do , I mean why not keep being good at it, and trading and building your traffic forever, why limit yourself? am I missing something?

A whore with limitations is not a very good thing to be is it?

[Vick]

Please see my last post in the 5 page discussion - some of the answers lie there


In my not so humble opinion TGP is not a necessary business model, one of the worst models ever.
That's not to say it doesn't make $.
I say more $ could be made with other models - TGP may be approaching the point of diminishing returns

Edited to add - the TGP guys I've met in person seemed ok, no big attitude - but this was a few years back

[the Shemp]

bump

[gonzo]

Originally posted by JoesHO1@Jul 8 2004, 03:58 PM
Say Shemp for example... and why do they feel they are so important, I mean be for real, the business model is necassary, But once you build all the traffic up, from them, why keep shooting yourself in the foot like some of theses guys do , I mean why not keep being good at it, and trading and building your traffic forever, why limit yourself? am I missing something?

A whore with limitations is not a very good thing to be is it?
Joe....I dont get the correlation between your message title and mentioning Shemp.

How is Shemp a whore?

Vick bro... this aint 1998 anymore.

[Rolo]

Hello again Shemp :bwave:

I was send a link to the other board where you post about TGPs, and I read some of your posts - after reading them, then we might not be so far apart in the perception that TGPs are business :-)

[Vick]

Originally posted by gonzo@Jul 12 2004, 06:34 PM
Vick bro... this aint 1998 anymore.
Exactly, Bro Gonzo

I'm ready to jump to the future, time to expand, try something new and different

[JR]

Originally posted by the Shemp@Jul 12 2004, 03:22 PM
bump
Hi,

Please don't be annoyed with the idiocy. That is part of message boards and it is a staple on adult message boards. As many have said, there are many here that want to learn as much as possible about everything, including TGP's. I for one am one of those who appreciates each reply you make and have a great deal of respect for who you are and what you do. You are successful at what you do... You have a lot to share and a lot of people are listening.

Please stay around and share some of your knowledge.

:rokk:

[JR]

Originally posted by Vick+Jul 12 2004, 03:47 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Vick @ Jul 12 2004, 03:47 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-gonzo@Jul 12 2004, 06:34 PM
Vick bro... this aint 1998 anymore.
Exactly, Bro Gonzo

I'm ready to jump to the future, time to expand, try something new and different [/b][/quote]
except you are not doing it.

the consumer drives the market. not TGP's. those people making the most money in this business are not trying to reinvent or replace the wheel. they are busy understanding and improving the wheel.

[Vick]

Here's a wild one for you
Don't know if it would work or not (or if it's been attempted) but it's worth a thought

A TGP with significant traffic charges a $2 a year access fee
That traffic is then a known credit card holder and user, quality traffic

If the surfer doesn't want to pay the fee send them where ever you want, to another site where they can be moved for whatever $

Siphon off the non credit card using traffic (countries/regions that historically don't use CC's) via IP ID to TGP's with sites that promote dialer's and such

[gonzo]

Originally posted by Vick+Jul 12 2004, 06:47 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Vick @ Jul 12 2004, 06:47 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-gonzo@Jul 12 2004, 06:34 PM
Vick bro... this aint 1998 anymore.
Exactly, Bro Gonzo

I'm ready to jump to the future, time to expand, try something new and different [/b][/quote]
Hey...Im openminded....

Ill accept for the sake of arguement that TGPs arent the answer ...the business model sucks and its destroying the industry.

Outside of pay per click/Search Engines....can you tell me how to get an average of 1000 -2000 unique clicks to my pay site per day for just the cost of bandwidth?

School is in session....you have the floor Dr Brown....take us "BACK TO THE FUTURE!"

[Rolo]

Spam? :unsure:

[Vick]

Gonzo and JR you both have PM's B)


Edit - see the wild one above for an idea I'll throw out in public

[gonzo]

Originally posted by Vick@Jul 12 2004, 06:59 PM
Here's a wild one for you
Don't know if it would work or not (or if it's been attempted) but it's worth a thought

A TGP with significant traffic charges a $2 a year access fee
That traffic is then a known credit card holder and user, quality traffic

If the surfer doesn't want to pay the fee send them where ever you want, to another site where they can be moved for whatever $

Siphon off the non credit card using traffic (countries/regions that historically don't use CC's) via IP ID to TGP's with sites that promote dialer's and such
Smells like AVS to me... but your talking about a play off of a pay site model.

I already got pay sites...I want to get traffic to them without using SE/pay per click models. How do I do it without TGPs?

And Joe.... how is Shemp a whore?

[JR]

Originally posted by gonzo@Jul 12 2004, 04:14 PM


And Joe.... how is Shemp a whore?
haha.

How is Joe a webmaster?

[Vick]

Tell ya what

We have some very different idea on this subject, I'm going to STFU and stay out of it

Would like to read what you have to say, thoughts, idea, concepts, inputs and so on

:okthumb: :stout: to ya

[gonzo]

Originally posted by Vick@Jul 12 2004, 07:31 PM
Tell ya what

We have some very different idea on this subject, I'm going to STFU and stay out of it

Would like to read what you have to say, thoughts, idea, concepts, inputs and so on

:okthumb: :stout: to ya
...its a little too late for that now. The TGP model was scoffed at and picked part as the destruction of the Pay site model.

Now Shemp is a whore....

I dont think so.

Instead of discussing and stratigizing on how to repair the current TGP model several of yall decided to fucking ridicule and dissect an invited guest. The shit went on for 5 pages.

Im openminded. I accept all of your statements to be true for the sake of discussion. Again....

1. Tell me a better/new business model to get 1000-2000 clicks a day to my pay site outside of pay per click/SE traffic. This also excludes affilaite programs. After all we are looking to the new and improved future.

2. Joe - why do you say Shemp is a whore?

[Vick]

Gonzo - see the 2nd PM and then if you still want me to continue ......

Also just for arguments sake what I proposed wouldn't exactly be the AVS model as an AVS acted as an aggregater and made payouts to various companies and individuals

Just a process to try to siphon off the freeloaders

[cj]

Gonzo, i'm going to take up your challenge ... because I want to hear the responses from those who face these problems every day in their business model.

1) There is too much free material overall on a tgp. Anything generic or that looks like another gallery should be rejected so the standard is higher and the 'sample' concept is just a sample, not a whole paysite.

2) The only sites that seem to convert well are those with exclusive content but you have to give away a LOT of your exclusive content to get listed regularly because tgp's are so saturated

3) Why aren't exclusive galleries and content treated like gold, or at least better than general submissions and if they are, where are those relationships happening?

4) Why allow submitters to submit multiple hosted galleries for the same site? 1 free gallery per site per day should be plenty

5) Why archive everything and make it available for free? Why not make a tgp display just TODAY'S free samples and all archives are for PAYSITES or the tgp has a paid area.

6) When many tgp's don't make enough money from selling porn site subscriptions, they start installing toolbars and then selling the programs to remove them, therefore IMO those tgp's are NOT even in our industry and are especially not helping it. This seems to be more the norm than legit tgp's. How do you tell the difference?

[gonzo]

Lots of questions... a few good ideas.
Here I have one better idea.

I want to reactivate OWNED. I think you will agree CJ neither of us will be bored with this topic and nobody else is going to touch it for fear of loosing advertising dollars.

Heres my idea lets turn it back on once again at 9:00 EST where the listener decides.

Vick and Joe ... Im not mad at you but I really want you both to come on the air and back up these statements. Where I come from its only fair that if you call a man a scumbag, thief and whore that you at least back up your claims and offer alternatives.

Shemp - I know your plenty pissed off at me and given the circumstances I cant blame you. You were an invited guest to dinner and you ended up being dinner. Your welcome to call in as well if you so desire.

I believe that there are plenty more people that want a voice into this as well. Well open up the phone lines, Skype and the chat room to everyone. This way you can decide for yourselves.

At the end of the night Id like to think we can walk away with some solutions or directions to go in to move forward....instead a schoolyard fight.


Its on OWNED.....9PM EST Tuesday night.....www.opranoradio.com

[Vick]

Gonzo - we have different ideas/takes on this

I didn't call anyone a scumbag, thief and/or whore
I attacked a business model
Said time and time again - Business only, nothing personal


If getting me on the radio is what it takes, let's do it

[Vick]

I offered to STFU but .... you keep egging me on so

Let's go to square one, the root of the problem.
Decreasing revenues and conversions (for some, I'd dare say most)

Causes
Market saturation (pie going into more slices)
Novelty wore off (when a new internet user first got on line back in the 90's the about first thing they did was find porn, now it's been there done that, waked off on the T- Shirt)
Abundance of Free material (only part of the equation but a significant one)
Lack of marketing skills (some trying this business couldn't sell a life jacket to a drowning man)

Can we agree if there were significantly less free porn then more porn consumers would be forced to purchase porn (on line or other wise)?

[gonzo]

Originally posted by Vick@Jul 12 2004, 08:22 PM
Gonzo - we have different ideas/takes on this

I didn't call anyone a scumbag, thief and/or whore
I attacked a business model
Said time and time again - Business only, nothing personal


If getting me on the radio is what it takes, let's do it
Lets discuss it! Im really interested in alternatives.


Anybody else interested?

[gonzo]

Originally posted by Vick@Jul 12 2004, 08:31 PM

Can we agree if there were significantly less free porn then more porn consumers would be forced to purchase porn (on line or other wise)?
Ive always agreed with that statement.
The genie is out of the bottle though.... should be a good show.

[Vick]

Here's somewhere we differ

Some of you look at the existing model of TGP and think well it's not the best but it's where the market is

My perspective is it's a bad business model

I really think we'll hit an impasse of the show as I'd be in favor of TGP's shutting down and changing over to text only links to sponsors - yeah I'm a radical living in a dream world but ... porn consumers would be forced to buy, not freeload

Look at the one of the prevalent revenue models of TGP's (and I admire this purely for the revenue generation aspect of it)
Selling ad space in the form of links to a webmasters gallery. Don't think any TGP owner is the Mother Teresa of Porn and these are businessmen trying to maximize profits
Leap in logic is that the selling of links generates more (and steady) revenue than actual links to sponsors

Why/how did that happen? Did that model come into place because TGP site owners weren't generating the revenues they had previously so they switched, or was it to generate more and steady revenue?

Chicken and the egg?

I've already given an alternative here also, with means to work all the traffic


Something else to think about
Are TGP's the welfare of porn? Here it's all free. Get something for nothing?
Or are they a viable marketing method?

Gonzo you've asked a few times about getting 1k - 2k hits to a paysite with other than TGP traffic
What is the average TGP conversion 1 in 1,000 - 1 in 2,000?
If that is the average is it worth the effort?
Obviously if you can get better mileage of it it ....... it can be worth it

[cj]

Don't forget the toll free hotline!!

1-877-442-0067

We haven't had any calls for a few weeks, must be time for some Oprano rants!

[cj]

why would anyone want the 1 - 2000 hits that had come from search engines through a free porn maze anyway.

why can't we all get our customers from search engines? there's enough there for everyone ... why send them somewhere else first to teach them how to freeload?

you want a person to sit at their computer. type in a search. browse a few sites that cost money, find one he/she likes and PAY FOR IT. Otherwise, this internet thing is just a big yellow pages only no money changes hands.

[Vick]

Originally posted by cj@Jul 12 2004, 09:00 PM
you want a person to sit at their computer. type in a search. browse a few sites that cost money, find one he/she likes and PAY FOR IT. Otherwise, this internet thing is just a big yellow pages only no money changes hands.
:wnw: :wnw: :wnw:

I :inlove: that post he he he

[gonzo]

...of course you do. But little weasels that spammed the Search engines ruined that for you.

Suffice to say Ill take every TGP click that anyone wants to send me...send me all your shit traffic. Ill take every last fucking click.

FREE SERGES CLICKS!!!

[JoesHO]

Gonzo, I was more referring to the fact that if a particular party is using the business model of a whores game, then why all of a sudden become elitist, if any whore can do it ... as you know I am greatly interested in the TGP model, and feel that it is a substantial way to get traffic ( I disagree that it is the TGP fault something does not convert or hold a member)

Unfortunatly Shemp was used as the example, after I saw him post on Weasles board, slamming Oprano, and he was the first one I thought of, actually sleazydream would have been a better example.....

sorry Shemp if you took personal offense, but hopping from board to board just to be able to pitch your stuff, ( a whores game , nothing wrong with it though, I believe strongly in it) Then turn on the board in favor of another sponsor, just becasue you did not like the other side of the argument to be heard for the masses to decide, is what a whore does.... I meant no personal shame to you!

Hell in fact I do not see why it is bad to be a whore at all....LOL

[cj]

fuck joe. you miss the point more than any webmaster i've seen on this board.

SHEMP WAS INVITED HERE TO BRING A TGP BACKGROUND TO OPRANO. He wasn't whoring anything, he wasn't here to spam his products, he was INVITED AS A TEACHER.

He needs to whore his products on oprano about as much as a crack dealer does.

[Vick]

CJ - I'm taking your SE post was tongue in cheek that's why I put the he he he's (I think most everyone got that but you never know)


Got a ton of stuff to get done but I'd really like to go no holds barred sometime on certain subjects


TGP's really aren't a friend of mine (a small paysite owner) I'll go into that in depth some other time


I can tell times are challenging by the amount of new affiliates I get to Cloud 9 Cash, when times are time and fur flies I see more new affiliates. Thanks to all who joined in the past few weeks :okthumb:

[JoesHO]

Originally posted by cj@Jul 12 2004, 06:49 PM
fuck joe. you miss the point more than any webmaster i've seen on this board.

SHEMP WAS INVITED HERE TO BRING A TGP BACKGROUND TO OPRANO. He wasn't whoring anything, he wasn't here to spam his products, he was INVITED AS A TEACHER.

He needs to whore his products on oprano about as much as a crack dealer does.
So what went wrong? and if that is true, why run straight to weasel afterwards? and worse yet, let weasel use you as a monkey in order to take a POT (Ilove that word) shot at serge and Mike in the process? why not just go back to GFY? why say anything negative about it here unless there were sour grapes, and if it was not nessassary to promote here, why shout out sour grapes aboput it then?

[Vick]

Joe - I don't read weasel's board and missed the fake drama

Can you link me?

It might not come up right here but I'll get the idea

[JoesHO]

Originally posted by Vick@Jul 12 2004, 07:12 PM
Joe - I don't read weasel's board and missed the fake drama

Can you link me?

It might not come up right here but I'll get the idea
No problem Vick, but would you rather me e-mail it to you, or ICQ you ?

I have the link ready, so let me know...

[Vick]

Thanks Joe

If you would just post it here please

[JoesHO]

http://www.weasel's/showthread.php?t=9621
(this was the shemp thread)

More rantings from the weasel
http://www.weasel's/showthread.php?t=9842

[Vick]

Thanks again Joe


Edited to add - Shemp showed he is a class act in the first thread
Peaches :) :okthumb:
Weasels are as Weasels do

[Peaches]

Obviously replace "weasel's" with the appropriate URL instead of clicking :awinky:

[Winetalk.com]

Originally posted by gonzo@Jul 12 2004, 09:12 PM


FREE SERGES CLICKS!!!
...they just pull me back!
;-))))

[cj]

Originally posted by JoesHO1+Jul 12 2004, 10:05 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (JoesHO1 @ Jul 12 2004, 10:05 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-cj@Jul 12 2004, 06:49 PM
fuck joe. you miss the point more than any webmaster i've seen on this board.

SHEMP WAS INVITED HERE TO BRING A TGP BACKGROUND TO OPRANO. He wasn't whoring anything, he wasn't here to spam his products, he was INVITED AS A TEACHER.

He needs to whore his products on oprano about as much as a crack dealer does.
So what went wrong? and if that is true, why run straight to weasel afterwards? and worse yet, let weasel use you as a monkey in order to take a POT (Ilove that word) shot at serge and Mike in the process? why not just go back to GFY? why say anything negative about it here unless there were sour grapes, and if it was not nessassary to promote here, why shout out sour grapes aboput it then? [/b][/quote]
because he and Gonzo were planning some Oprano biz & it fell through.

I'd have done exactly the same thing shemp did ... minus the weasel. He is trying to shove it up our asses ... let him, it doesn't make any difference to us.

Its disappointing but I don't see any global warming as a result ...

[esdmodels]

Originally posted by gonzo@Jul 12 2004, 04:40 PM
1. Tell me a better/new business model to get 1000-2000 clicks a day to my pay site outside of pay per click/SE traffic. This also excludes affilaite programs. After all we are looking to the new and improved future.


Use TGP redirect service, ha ha hah :)
(is's humor)

[Sabby]

No they are not whores... they are SLUTS!!!

TGP's are sluts and paysites are whores... sluts are very bad for whore's business.


Sabby:)

[Rolo]

Sabby - so true... hahahaha :okthumb:

[esdmodels]

Originally posted by Sabby@Jul 13 2004, 01:48 PM
No they are not whores... they are SLUTS!!!

TGP's are sluts and paysites are whores... sluts are very bad for whore's business.


Sabby:)
No
TGP- crack dealers
pay sites - Addicts :)
content-money
traffic- drugs
Redirect service- Soprano's clan :)
DDOSsers- Al Qaeda :)

[Sabby]

Actually the 100+ free cam girl networks are the worst business model ever. I got away from that shit long ago.

Those sluts really piss me off more than TGPs even, LOL.


Sabby:)