New weapon to stop Michael Moore

[RawAlex]

http://www.thehill.com/news/062404/moore.aspx

Nice trick. You cannot have ads that mention or show a candidate.

Right... this will go to court, that is for sure.

Alex

[Sharpie]

That is almost closing the barn door after the horse is already out.....

After July 30th - he won't need much advertising.... it would affect the other movie being made more...

[Peaches]

Rad Bradbury's none too pleased either :

http://www.cnn.com/2004/SHOWBIZ/Movies/06/...t.ap/index.html (http://www.cnn.com/2004/SHOWBIZ/Movies/06/21/bradbury.fahrenheit.ap/index.html)

[Sharpie]

Sure - like he owns the word 'Fahrenheit'

[Peaches]

Originally posted by Sharpie@Jun 24 2004, 10:52 AM
Sure - like he owns the word 'Fahrenheit'
True, but it's clear MM made the name of his movie to mirror Fahrenheit 451. If it was called "9/11 is in Fahrenheit" or something, THEN you would only look at the word. But to copy a title and merely replace the previous 3 numbers with 3 other numbers...well, I'd be ticked off too :)

[Almighty Colin]

Know what's funny? Stuff like this only HELPS Michael Moore's movie. I am in awe of the Michael Moore promotion machine as is. They are able to take any news story involving him and turn it into a conspiracy against Moore. It's most impressive. Yesterday's debut on two screens in New York was billed as a record-breaking day (it was for those two theaters). Nice headlines followed on that. Clever.

It's amusing how much keeps getting handed to him by his "opposition".

[Peaches]

Originally posted by Colin@Jun 24 2004, 12:05 PM
Know what's funny? Stuff like this only HELPS Michael Moore's movie. I am in awe of the Michael Moore promotion machine as is. They are able to take any news story involving him and turn it into a conspiracy against Moore. It's most impressive. Yesterday's debut on two screens in New York was billed as a record-breaking day (it was for those two theaters). Nice headlines followed on that. Clever.

It's amusing how much keeps getting handed to him by his "opposition".
And Clinton and Hilary knew how to market their books. :)

However, I will not be putting money into the pockets of any of the three :awinky:

[Meni]

Yeah don't go see Fahrenheit cuz it may make you think twice about bush
i'll pay for any of you bush backers to see fahrenheit

is bush and cheny still trying to say Iraq had ties to al quaida ?
the 9/11 panel says bull shit
cheney says he has more info than the panel
ok then talk to the fuckin panel cheney
you fuckin pussy

[Evil Chris]

I'm anxious to see it this weekend.

[grimm]

Im going to see it late tonight, should i close my eyes when they show The President?


equal time laws should only apply to the media, they are there to help the little guys, and are meant for political COVERAGE, not the actual showing of the image of the president.


Meaning, if a news program wants to debate bush for 15 minutes, then, in an election year, they have to devote equal time for Kerry, or any other candidate.

This is all hogwash, limiting free speech is the path that leads to the road of censorship. If the government, and all of its partisan bullshit, doesn't want itself painted in a bad light, then stop doing things that paint them in a bad light. And certainly do not try to retroactively go back and erase the backdoor politics and doublespeak that got you where you are today. That is the problem with politics on many ends, you must cheat, steal and double deal, misspeak, make false promises, etc, to get to the highest offices in the land, but then once you get there, you want to rewind and play Mr Smith goes to washington, and pretend those promises aren't being kept.



Ill let you know how the movie is. I thought Bowling for columbine was very well made. I did not agree with parts of it, but it hit nerves and was a well put together and well directed documentary.


The best part of the whole movie is when Heston exposed himself as the double talker he really is. how he is representative of nothing, but merely a politician. And how Moore brought to light that not all NRA members spout the propoganda he is paid handsomely to scream at his rallies, and how he is a man of little moral value in the face of much greater demons.


discuss:)

[Mike AI]

Originally posted by grimm@Jun 25 2004, 02:01 PM
Im going to see it late tonight, should i close my eyes when they show The President?


equal time laws should only apply to the media, they are there to help the little guys, and are meant for political COVERAGE, not the actual showing of the image of the president.


Meaning, if a news program wants to debate bush for 15 minutes, then, in an election year, they have to devote equal time for Kerry, or any other candidate.

This is all hogwash, limiting free speech is the path that leads to the road of censorship. If the government, and all of its partisan bullshit, doesn't want itself painted in a bad light, then stop doing things that paint them in a bad light. And certainly do not try to retroactively go back and erase the backdoor politics and doublespeak that got you where you are today. That is the problem with politics on many ends, you must cheat, steal and double deal, misspeak, make false promises, etc, to get to the highest offices in the land, but then once you get there, you want to rewind and play Mr Smith goes to washington, and pretend those promises aren't being kept.



Ill let you know how the movie is. I thought Bowling for columbine was very well made. I did not agree with parts of it, but it hit nerves and was a well put together and well directed documentary.


The best part of the whole movie is when Heston exposed himself as the double talker he really is. how he is representative of nothing, but merely a politician. And how Moore brought to light that not all NRA members spout the propoganda he is paid handsomely to scream at his rallies, and how he is a man of little moral value in the face of much greater demons.


discuss:)


Grimm I thought I had you broke of all that liberal crap?!?!?!

:P

[grimm]

Originally posted by Colin@Jun 24 2004, 08:05 AM
Know what's funny? Stuff like this only HELPS Michael Moore's movie. I am in awe of the Michael Moore promotion machine as is. They are able to take any news story involving him and turn it into a conspiracy against Moore. It's most impressive. Yesterday's debut on two screens in New York was billed as a record-breaking day (it was for those two theaters). Nice headlines followed on that. Clever.

It's amusing how much keeps getting handed to him by his "opposition".
Roger Ebert's review


FAHRENHEIT 9/11 / ***1/2 ®

June 24, 2004

Lions Gate/IFC Films presents a documentary directed by Michael Moore.
Narrated by Moore. Running time: 110 minutes. Rated R (some violent
and disturbing images, and for language).

BY ROGER EBERT

Michael Moore's "Fahrenheit 9/11" is less an expose of George W. Bush
than a dramatization of what Moore sees as a failed and dangerous
presidency. The charges in the film will not come as news to those who
pay attention to politics, but Moore illustrates them with dramatic
images and a relentless commentary track that essentially concludes
Bush is incompetent, dishonest, failing in the war on terrorism, and
has bad taste in friends.

Although Moore's narration ranges from outrage to sarcasm, the most
devastating passage in the film speaks for itself. That's when Bush,
who was reading My Pet Goat to a classroom of Florida children, is
notified of the second attack on the World Trade Center, and yet
lingers with the kids for almost seven minutes before finally leaving
the room. His inexplicable paralysis wasn't underlined in news reports
at the time, and only Moore thought to contact the teacher in that
schoolroom -- who, as it turned out, had made her own video of the
visit. The expression on Bush's face as he sits there is odd indeed.

Bush, here and elsewhere in the film, is characterized as a man who
owes a lot to his friends, including those who helped bail him out of
business ventures. Moore places particular emphasis on what he sees as
a long-term friendship between the Bush family (including both
presidents) and powerful Saudi Arabians. More than $1.4 billion in
Saudi money has flowed into the coffers of Bush family enterprises, he
says, and after 9/11 the White House helped expedite flights out of
the country carrying, among others, members of the bin Laden family
(which disowns its most famous member).

Moore examines the military records released by Bush to explain his
disappearance from the Texas Air National Guard, and finds that the
name of another pilot has been blacked out. This pilot, he learns, was
Bush's close friend James R. Bath, who became Texas money manager for
the billionaire bin Ladens. Another indication of the closeness of the
Bushes and the Saudis: The law firm of James Baker, the secretary of
State for Bush's father, was hired by the Saudis to defend them
against a suit by a group of 9/11 victims and survivors, who charged
that the Saudis had financed al-Qaida.

To Moore, this is more evidence that Bush has an unhealthy
relationship with the Saudis, and that it may have influenced his
decision to go to war against Iraq at least partially on their behalf.
The war itself Moore considers unjustified (no WMDs, no Hussein-bin
Laden link), and he talks with American soldiers, including amputees,
who complain bitterly about Bush's proposed cuts of military salaries
at the same time he was sending them into a war that they (at least,
the ones Moore spoke to) hated.

Moore also shows American military personnel who are apparently
enjoying the war; he has footage of soldiers who use torture
techniques not in a prison but in the field, where they hood an Iraqi
prisoner, call him "Ali Baba" and pose for videos while touching his
genitals.

Moore brings a fresh impact to familiar material by the way he
marshals his images. We are all familiar with the controversy over the
2000 election, which was settled by the U.S. Supreme Court. What I
hadn't seen before was footage of the ratification of Bush's election
by the U.S. Congress. An election can be debated at the request of one
senator and one representative; 10 representatives rise to challenge
it, but not a single senator. As Moore shows the challengers, one
after another, we cannot help noting that they are eight black women,
one Asian woman and one black man. They are all gaveled into silence
by the chairman of the joint congressional session -- Vice President
Al Gore. The urgency and futility of the scene reawakens old feelings
for those who believe Bush is an illegitimate president.

"Fahrenheit 9/11" opens on a note not unlike Moore's earlier films,
such as "Roger & Me" and "Bowling for Columbine." Moore, as narrator,
brings humor and sarcasm to his comments, and occasionally appears
onscreen in a gadfly role. It's vintage Moore, for example, when he
brings along an unsuspecting Marine recruiter as he confronts
congressmen, urging them to have their children enlist in the service.
And he makes good use of candid footage, including an eerie video
showing Bush practicing facial expressions before going live with his
address to the nation about 9/11.

Apparently Bush and other members of his administration don't know
what every TV reporter knows, that a satellite image can be live
before they get the cue to start talking. That accounts for the
quease-inducing footage of Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz
wetting his pocket comb in his mouth before slicking back his hair.
When that doesn't do it, he spits in his hand and wipes it down. If
his mother is alive, I hope for his sake she doesn't see this film.

Such scenes are typical of vintage Moore, catching his subjects off
guard. But his film grows steadily darker, and Moore largely
disappears from it, as he focuses on people such as Lila Lipscomb,
from Moore's hometown of Flint, Mich.; she reads a letter from her
son, written days before he was killed in Iraq. It urges his family to
work for Bush's defeat.

"Fahrenheit 9/11" is a compelling, persuasive film, at odds with the
White House effort to present Bush as a strong leader. He comes across
as a shallow, inarticulate man, simplistic in speech and inauthentic
in manner. If the film is not quite as electrifying as Moore's
"Bowling for Columbine," that may be because Moore has toned down his
usual exuberance and was sobered by attacks on the factual accuracy of
elements of "Columbine"; playing with larger stakes, he is more
cautious here, and we get an op-ed piece, not a stand-up routine. But
he remains one of the most valuable figures on the political
landscape, a populist rabble-rouser, humorous and effective; the
outrage and incredulity in his film are an exhilarating response to
Bush's determined repetition of the same stubborn sound bites.

[grimm]

Originally posted by Mike AI+Jun 25 2004, 11:11 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Mike AI @ Jun 25 2004, 11:11 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-grimm@Jun 25 2004, 02:01 PM
Im going to see it late tonight, should i close my eyes when they show The President?


equal time laws should only apply to the media, they are there to help the little guys, and are meant for political COVERAGE, not the actual showing of the image of the president.


Meaning, if a news program wants to debate bush for 15 minutes, then, in an election year, they have to devote equal time for Kerry, or any other candidate.

This is all hogwash, limiting free speech is the path that leads to the road of censorship. If the government, and all of its partisan bullshit, doesn't want itself painted in a bad light, then stop doing things that paint them in a bad light. And certainly do not try to retroactively go back and erase the backdoor politics and doublespeak that got you where you are today. That is the problem with politics on many ends, you must cheat, steal and double deal, misspeak, make false promises, etc, to get to the highest offices in the land, but then once you get there, you want to rewind and play Mr Smith goes to washington, and pretend those promises aren't being kept.



Ill let you know how the movie is. I thought Bowling for columbine was very well made. I did not agree with parts of it, but it hit nerves and was a well put together and well directed documentary.


The best part of the whole movie is when Heston exposed himself as the double talker he really is. how he is representative of nothing, but merely a politician. And how Moore brought to light that not all NRA members spout the propoganda he is paid handsomely to scream at his rallies, and how he is a man of little moral value in the face of much greater demons.


discuss:)


Grimm I thought I had you broke of all that liberal crap?!?!?!

:P [/b][/quote]
huh? Michael Moore is a republican, card carrying memeber of the NRA, is from what ive heard, pr-life, and against overspending on social programs.


sounds liberal to me;)

[grimm]

And besides, i was arguing against the equal time rules. those are stupid and should be thrown out. they have no merit, and have been used against their primary purpose. instead of a defensive measure to protect minority candidates, they can be used as offensive weapons by majority candidates against minority candidates. Another case where the spirit of the law does not match the actuality of the law.

[grimm]

oh and i read a speech on stem cell research Moore gave, and he falls to the right on that one. He's more conservative than our President, who is at most a moderate.

I wouldn't vote michael moore for office, he is too conservative for my moderate ass:)


Have you seen his movies or read his books yet? i think you'd enjoy them!good filmmaking, whether you like the politics or not.

Also pick up Al Franken's book. he hits it dead on, and it is a funny and enjoyable stab at political satire from another republican.

[Mike AI]

Originally posted by grimm@Jun 25 2004, 02:42 PM
oh and i read a speech on stem cell research Moore gave, and he falls to the right on that one. He's more conservative than our President, who is at most a moderate.

I wouldn't vote michael moore for office, he is too conservative for my moderate ass:)


Have you seen his movies or read his books yet? i think you'd enjoy them!good filmmaking, whether you like the politics or not.

Also pick up Al Franken's book. he hits it dead on, and it is a funny and enjoyable stab at political satire from another republican.
Grimm I will have to set you straight over dinner.....

[SykkBoy]

I loved Moore's interview on The Daily Show yesterday
he explained this movie is basically him showing facts and then offering his opinions up on them as he sees them.

He also urged more righwingers to come out and bad mouth his movie so even more people will go see it...he's a marketing genius

[grimm]

Originally posted by Mike AI+Jun 25 2004, 12:08 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Mike AI @ Jun 25 2004, 12:08 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-grimm@Jun 25 2004, 02:42 PM
oh and i read a speech on stem cell research Moore gave, and he falls to the right on that one. He's more conservative than our President, who is at most a moderate.

I wouldn't vote michael moore for office, he is too conservative for my moderate ass:)


Have you seen his movies or read his books yet? i think you'd enjoy them!good filmmaking, whether you like the politics or not.

Also pick up Al Franken's book. he hits it dead on, and it is a funny and enjoyable stab at political satire from another republican.
Grimm I will have to set you straight over dinner..... [/b][/quote]
well you better start reading and watching movies, otherwise you can't debate Michael Moore, it would be all conjecture and hearsay on your part, not having experienced it in first person;) so crank up that DVD player and get those reading glasses on, cause dinners in like 4 hours;)


ill even let you borrow my copy of his last book, and Columbine, if you are super nice, i might throw in the Franken book:)

[grimm]

Originally posted by SykkBoy@Jun 25 2004, 12:09 PM
I loved Moore's interview on The Daily Show yesterday
he explained this movie is basically him showing facts and then offering his opinions up on them as he sees them.

He also urged more righwingers to come out and bad mouth his movie so even more people will go see it...he's a marketing genius
hes built a machine, its funny as hell, the more the people bash his movie (of which noone has seen it)..the more people will go see it.


an example, this is a low rent documentary, yet it has two screens tonight at the biggest movie theater in new orleans? If it had just been ignored and not harped on, youd have to wait until it came out on dvd. Its hilarious, every show bfore 10:30 is already sold out, i could not believe it! Im going to the 12:45, since my girlfriend work till after 11. but this leaves me 4 hours of unencumbered love from my partners;)



Too bad the macihne couldn't get behind some of th other independent films i want to see, that i have to drive to Baton Rouge to see:)

[Buff]

Originally posted by Meni@Jun 24 2004, 12:04 PM
Yeah don't go see Fahrenheit cuz it may make you think twice about bush
i'll pay for any of you bush backers to see fahrenheit

is bush and cheny still trying to say Iraq had ties to al quaida ?
the 9/11 panel says bull shit
cheney says he has more info than the panel
ok then talk to the fuckin panel cheney
you fuckin pussy
OK, Meni, I'll take you up on that offer. Buy me and my woman tickets to see it.

[grimm]

Originally posted by Buff+Jun 25 2004, 01:20 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Buff @ Jun 25 2004, 01:20 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-Meni@Jun 24 2004, 12:04 PM
Yeah don't go see Fahrenheit cuz it may make you think twice about bush
i'll pay for any of you bush backers to see fahrenheit

is bush and cheny still trying to say Iraq had ties to al quaida ?
the 9/11 panel says bull shit
cheney says he has more info than the panel
ok then talk to the fuckin panel cheney
you fuckin pussy
OK, Meni, I'll take you up on that offer. Buy me and my woman tickets to see it. [/b][/quote]
Ill take your woman to see it, and she can spell it out phoenetically when she gets hom in the morning.


snoochie boochies;)

[Rolo]

I say let Michael Moore speak all that he wants.. preferable live where he can not edit it by himself :rolleyes: