OK Vick, I promised you , so now I produce

[JoesHO]

Ok so I promised you a few days ago I would hit you with Kerry's stance on the issues...

Here it is , if you want more tell me. feel free to dispute any fact!
but please use only FACTs to dispute them with.

1.) Economy: John Kerry’s priority will be middle class families who are working hard to cover the mortgage, pay the high cost of health care, child care and tuition, or just trying to get ahead.

Kerry has proposed creating jobs through a new manufacturing jobs credit, by investing in new energy industries, restoring technology, and stopping layoffs in education.

John Kerry has the courage to roll back Bush’s tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans so we can invest in education and healthcare. He isn’t afraid to crack down on corporations that are hiding their money in Bermuda to avoid paying their fair share and will end special tax giveaways to companies that ship jobs abroad. And he will defend the rights of workers, consumers and shareholders in holding corporations accountable for their actions.

Kerry is detailing a key part of his overall jobs agenda

a.) End tax breaks that encourage companies to move jobs overseas by eliminating the ability of companies to defer paying U.S. taxes on foreign income.
b.) abusive international tax loopholes.
c.) Cut the corporate tax rate by 5 percent.
d.) Restart job growth today with an expanded New Jobs Tax Credit that covers new jobs in manufacturing, other industries affected by outsourcing and small businesses.
e.) Increase investment to jumpstart the economy by encouraging American companies to bring their foreign profits back to America as part of a comprehensive tax reform that ends incentives to keep future profits overseas.
f.) Foreign taxes are one-third lower than U.S. taxes. When an American company invests in America it can expect to pay an average tax rate of 31 percent. When this company invests abroad, it faces an average tax rate of 21 percent. [Department of Treasury, "The Deferral of Income Earned through U.S. Controlled Foreign Corporations," December 2000]
g.) The average tax rate in the countries America invests in has fallen sharply over the last twenty years proving an increasing incentive to ship jobs overseas. In 1984 the average tax rate paid by American companies on foreign income was 34 percent - even higher than the U.S. tax rate. But the foreign rate has fallen steadily, reaching a low of 21 percent in 1996. Although U.S. deferral rules have been largely unchanged over this period, declining corporate tax rates in foreign countries and a shift in the countries where Americans invest mean that deferral today provides a much larger incentive to ship jobs overseas than it did 20 years ago. [Department of Treasury, "The Deferral of Income Earned through U.S. Controlled Foreign Corporations," December 2000]
h.) Deferring taxes provides a big tax break for corporations and encourages them to keep their profits locked up overseas. American companies do not have to pay taxes on their active foreign income until they bring it back to the United States. If they keep their money abroad, a company can avoid paying U.S. taxes entirely. In addition, this provides an incentive for companies to keep re-investing their money abroad, and not to bring it back to contribute investment and growth to the American economy.
i.) In total, not only do American companies defer paying taxes on income earned abroad, but they end up getting an $8 billion annual subsidy for investing abroad - that is, American companies pay negative U.S. income taxes on their foreign investments. According to a study published by the conservative American Enterprise Institute written by two leading tax economists, including an economist at the U.S. Treasury, American companies get an annual tax subsidy of $8 billion for investing abroad. That is, their taxes are currently $8 billion lower than they would be if all foreign income taxes were entirely eliminated. This is because the current system of deferral and cross-crediting allows companies to effectively receive net tax credits from the U.S. Treasury for their foreign investments. [Harry Grubert and John Mutti, Taxing International Business Income: Dividend Exemption vs. the Current System, AEI Press, 2001]
j.) The tax laws for income earned in foreign countries have been so complicated that the system is almost completely broken. The rules of Subpart F which govern the taxation of foreign subsidiaries controlled by American companies have become increasingly complicated over time, adding to the overall complexity of the tax code and making it easier for companies to exploit loopholes to escape taxes.
k.) Experts agree that deferral provides a substantial incentive for American companies to locate investment and jobs overseas.
l.) Cut the corporate tax rate by 5 percent. Kerry's proposal will not increase the deficit or corporate taxes by one dime. All of the savings from ending tax breaks will go towards lowering the corporate tax rate from 35 percent today to 33.25 percent - a 5 percent reduction.
m.) Enhancing the competitiveness of U.S. companies by cutting taxes for more than 99 percent of taxpaying companies. By ending tax incentives to move jobs overseas and using those funds to lower the corporate tax rate the Kerry international tax reform will increase investment and hiring by American companies. An analysis of IRS data shows that more than 99 percent of corporations paying corporate income taxes would see their taxes reduced by Kerry's proposal.
n.) Lowering the tax differential with foreign countries. The tax differential between U.S. corporate rates and foreign corporate rates have grown over the last two decades. Kerry's proposal would begin to narrow that gap again.
o.) More than $639 billion of American profits are stuck abroad. At the end of 2002 American companies were keeping $639 billion in profits abroad, avoiding having to pay taxes on this money. This is up sharply from $403 billion in profits in 1999. [CRS, "Tax Exemption for Repatriated Foreign Earnings," 10/22/2003]
p.) Encouraging companies to bring that money back to America with a one-year, 10 percent tax holiday. Kerry's plan will encourage companies to bring that money back and invest it in the American economy. For a one-year period only, Kerry will provide companies with a special low rate of 10 percent on any profits they reinvest in the United States for companies with a domestic reinvestment plan. This rate will only apply to repatriations in excess of average repatriations over a base period.
q.) Increasing investment. By ending future incentives to keep profits abroad and combining this with an appropriate transition that provides a one-time tax holiday this would increase investment and stimulate the American economy, helping to re-start job growth.
r.) Paying for the New Jobs Tax Credit. The tax holiday would result in an immediate revenue gain which would pay for the New Jobs Tax Credit - another boost to job growth in


I suppose due to length, I better leave you with only one issue a day to disolve, huh?

tommorrow I will out line a small one, like immigration, how is that?









:)

[Vick]

Joe - thanks but that's a lot of campaign rhetoric and doublespeak (that's not to say there isn't anything positive in this statement)

My mind isn't up to going through the whole thing right now but here's a couple things that stick out

middle class families who are working hard to cover the mortgage .....
Like no one else works hard, in fact on the face of it I'd think upper class families work HARDER (many parters in law firms work 80+ hours a week)
This is an obvious cry to the larger middle class to get their support (that's politics)

roll back Bush’s tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans
The so called wealthiest American still pay more taxes than anyone else - this is a(n almost) socialist statement - a redistribution of wealth - no good

Foreign taxes are one-third lower than U.S. taxes.
Um is this in reference to corporate taxes? Don't think it's about personal taxes which claim a higher % of income in many nations (ask our UK or Canadian friends)

Increase investment to jumpstart the economy
What jumpstart? the overall #'s look pretty good for the past year

I think we also need to consider what type of jobs have gone overseas, are they manufacturing? - Things that union scale wages (and cheap labor) might have forced companies to outsource to remain competitive?
Are they tech jobs? Are they jobs that don't require skills that no American really wants to do?


Politics are a lot of snake oil, double speak and promises
It's not good to follow anything or anyone blindly

Working class people aren't lazy and big business isn't inherently bad

[Winetalk.com]

Vick,
amazing!

You and me found the same inconsistensies in Kerrry's "plan"

[Vick]

p.s. Here's the source for you Joe

http://www.johnkerry.com/issues/

and something for devoted Democrats to think about
Jerry Springer is going to be a delegate at the Democratic National Convention
I can't figure out if he's looking for new guests or planning to catch up with some old guests


Edit for spelling



Last edited by Vick at May 29 2004, 04:03 AM

[Vick]

Originally posted by Serge_Oprano@May 29 2004, 03:58 AM
Vick,
amazing!

You and me found the same inconsistensies in Kerrry's "plan"
he he he

what the hell are we doing up at 5:37?

[Winetalk.com]

Originally posted by Vick@May 29 2004, 04:01 AM
p.s. Here's the source for you Joe

http://www.johnkerry.com/issues/

and something for devoted Democrats to think about
Jerry Springer is going to be a delegate at the Democratic National Convention
I can't figure out if he's looking for new guests or planning to catch up with some old guests


Edit for spelling
hahhahaahahhahahahahahahaha,
I'm sure if he did the show from the floor of the convention,
he'd won the Pulitzer Prize
;-))))

[Winetalk.com]

http://www.johnkerry.com/issues/women/
Standing up for Fairness, Dignity, Rights of Women and Opening Doors for their Success
“In case after case, President Bush’s actions have made American women less safe and less secure - on the job and on the streets. As president, I will put American government and our legal system back on the side of women. I will stand up for their security, ensure their safety, support their rights, and guarantee their dignity. This nation can do no less.”
- John Kerry, March 8, 2003


Mr. Kerry,
you are over reacting,
women's safety can be achieved by simply isolating Pushpills and keeping him away from them!

It's a real tragedy that he bloomed during the Bush's presidency!
;-))))

[Vick]

Joe - since we going on about some of Kerry's platform please allow me to pick a few pieces to look at

Here's one - http://www.johnkerry.com/issues/children/h...head_start.html (http://www.johnkerry.com/issues/children/head_start.html)
Head Start
John Kerry will work to fully fund the Head Start program, so that every 3 and 4-year-old in poverty can receive the comprehensive cognitive, social/emotional, health, and parent education services needed for success. And he will never block grant Head Start like President Bush has proposed doing, putting at risk an important and proven successful program.

Well if this is going to be done for children in poverty situations what's going to be done for my son (who will be 3 July 18)?
Odds are the American taxpayer will get a better return spending tax dollars on my son

You know what should be done - NOTHING!!! Not for my son and not for children in "poverty"

In fact at this point I'm ready to make a department of the family and name Bill Cosby as the head of that department - just so he can make a speech every week to tell American don't buy the $200 sneakers, spend the $200 on hooked on phonics - BE PARENTS, BE RESPONSIBLE

This looks to be throwing money at a symptom and doing nothing about the cause or real problem

Edit - for spelling - he he he back to bed for me
We await your replies Joe :yowsa:



Last edited by Vick at May 29 2004, 04:19 AM

[Winetalk.com]

Originally posted by Vick+May 29 2004, 04:03 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Vick @ May 29 2004, 04:03 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin--Serge_Oprano@May 29 2004, 03:58 AM
Vick,
amazing!

You and me found the same inconsistensies in Kerrry's "plan"
he he he

what the hell are we doing up at 5:37?[/b][/quote]
I had 2! great bottles of wine with LL yesterday. After we finished 2000 Chianti,
the restaurant owner went in the back and brought 1996 Riserva of the same. Told me it costs $20 more and if we don't like it-
he'll take it back.

After everything was said and done,
I had him sign LEGAL CONTRACT that he'd have a bottle for us when we come there next time.

...but now I pay for it being
"sleepless in Boca"
;-)))

[Winetalk.com]

http://www.johnkerry.com/issues/nurses/

OK, Mr. Kerry,
you have a hard on for nurces and this si why you singled them out and made them the part of your platform.

but what are your plans about 475 other professions?

why in the God's name ONLY nurses were singled out????

[Joe Sixpack]

Originally posted by Vick@May 29 2004, 01:16 AM
This looks to be throwing money at a symptom and doing nothing about the cause or real problem
Okay, if poverty is the symptom, what's the cause?

[Winetalk.com]

Originally posted by Joe Sixpack+May 29 2004, 06:33 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Joe Sixpack @ May 29 2004, 06:33 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin--Vick@May 29 2004, 01:16 AM
This looks to be throwing money at a symptom and doing nothing about the cause or real problem
Okay, if poverty is the symptom, what's the cause?[/b][/quote]
persecutions of aborigenese

[Joe Sixpack]

Originally posted by Serge_Oprano+May 29 2004, 03:42 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Serge_Oprano @ May 29 2004, 03:42 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>Originally posted by -Joe Sixpack@May 29 2004, 06:33 AM
<!--QuoteBegin--Vick@May 29 2004, 01:16 AM
This looks to be throwing money at a symptom and doing nothing about the cause or real problem
Okay, if poverty is the symptom, what's the cause?
persecutions of aborigenese[/b][/quote]
Serge you're not making much sense.

Sure the aborigines (note the spelling) have been treated appallingly, as have America's indigeous people, the native Americans.

Do you have another point to make?

[Almighty Colin]

Originally posted by Joe Sixpack+May 29 2004, 06:33 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Joe Sixpack @ May 29 2004, 06:33 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin--Vick@May 29 2004, 01:16 AM
This looks to be throwing money at a symptom and doing nothing about the cause or real problem
Okay, if poverty is the symptom, what's the cause?[/b][/quote]
Stupidity and the socio-economic class into which you are born. In that order.

Haven't you read the Bell Curve? Page 127.

[Vick]

This is very scary

John Kerry strongly supports labor law reforms to assure that nurses have the right to organize. He believes that the card check and neutrality system is the most fair and equitable way for employees to establish their desire to form a union and for employers to recognize the union and begin negotiations. John Kerry worked closely with nurses in Brockton, Massachusetts to settle a strike and he understands that too often working conditions do not improve without the right to organize. John Kerry believes freedom of workers to form unions and bargain collectively is a fundamental right and he will not stand for a labor law system in which the union doors are shut for millions of workers.

Unions have outlived their necessity and have become a tool for those who don't want to put forth efforts and get paid for substandard work

Yes unions were needed in the last century, today they are an evil that holds back productivity and encourages workers not to perform to the best of their abilities.
Unions make it near impossible for an employer to reward employees on merit, productivity and ability

[Joe Sixpack]

Originally posted by Colin+May 29 2004, 05:50 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Colin @ May 29 2004, 05:50 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>Originally posted by -Joe Sixpack@May 29 2004, 06:33 AM
<!--QuoteBegin--Vick@May 29 2004, 01:16 AM
This looks to be throwing money at a symptom and doing nothing about the cause or real problem
Okay, if poverty is the symptom, what's the cause?
Stupidity and the socio-economic class into which you are born. In that order.

Haven't you read the Bell Curve? Page 127.[/b][/quote]
Do you think stupidity is hereditary?

[Vick]

Serge - that sounds excellent/delicious!

Joesixpack - Headstart programs address a symptom, that is children not getting comprehensive cognitive, social/emotional, health, and parent education services

The government should not be providing "comprehensive cognitive, social/emotional, health, and parent education services". Parents provide those things

The problem is a lack of personal responsibility. If you have children, BE A REAL PARENT, DON'T EXPECT OR ALLOW THE GOVERNMENT TO RAISE YOUR CHILDREN

[Vick]

Originally posted by Joe Sixpack+May 29 2004, 08:58 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Joe Sixpack @ May 29 2004, 08:58 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>Originally posted by -Colin@May 29 2004, 05:50 AM
Originally posted by -Joe Sixpack@May 29 2004, 06:33 AM
<!--QuoteBegin--Vick@May 29 2004, 01:16 AM
This looks to be throwing money at a symptom and doing nothing about the cause or real problem
Okay, if poverty is the symptom, what's the cause?
Stupidity and the socio-economic class into which you are born. In that order.

Haven't you read the Bell Curve? Page 127.
Do you think stupidity is hereditary?[/b][/quote]
Yes!!!

[Almighty Colin]

Originally posted by Joe Sixpack@May 29 2004, 08:58 AM
Do you think stupidity is hereditary?
I think the answer to the "nature vs. nurture" debate is "nature AND nurture".
The Blank Slate is dead.

[Winetalk.com]

Originally posted by Joe Sixpack+May 29 2004, 08:50 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Joe Sixpack @ May 29 2004, 08:50 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>Originally posted by -Serge_Oprano@May 29 2004, 03:42 AM
Originally posted by -Joe Sixpack@May 29 2004, 06:33 AM
<!--QuoteBegin--Vick@May 29 2004, 01:16 AM
This looks to be throwing money at a symptom and doing nothing about the cause or real problem
Okay, if poverty is the symptom, what's the cause?
persecutions of aborigenese
Serge you're not making much sense.

Sure the aborigines (note the spelling) have been treated appallingly, as have America's indigeous people, the native Americans.

Do you have another point to make?[/b][/quote]
yes, I do.

why do Australians making themselves concerned with our problems?

Have you run out of your own?

[Mike AI]

One Joe left the debate, a new one joined!

[PornoDoggy]

Originally posted by Vick@May 29 2004, 04:01 AM
p.s. Here's the source for you Joe

http://www.johnkerry.com/issues/

and something for devoted Democrats to think about
Jerry Springer is going to be a delegate at the Democratic National Convention
I can't figure out if he's looking for new guests or planning to catch up with some old guests


Edit for spelling
Given a choice between Jerry Springer and Pat Robertson, I'll take Jerry Springer any day of the week.

[PornoDoggy]

Originally posted by Vick@May 29 2004, 08:57 AM
Unions have outlived their necessity and have become a tool for those who don't want to put forth efforts and get paid for substandard work

Yes unions were needed in the last century, today they are an evil that holds back productivity and encourages workers not to perform to the best of their abilities.
Unions make it near impossible for an employer to reward employees on merit, productivity and ability
OMG ... pull the string, hear the dolly talk.

Your response is very little different than Kerry's. Kerry is reciting a set-piece from the playbook of the left; you are regurgitating the same old pablum usually spewed out by the right, who think everyone should be happy with Walmart wages.

[Almighty Colin]

Originally posted by PornoDoggy@May 29 2004, 11:33 AM
Given a choice between Jerry Springer and Pat Robertson, I'll take Jerry Springer any day of the week.
Especially on Sunday.

Sidenote (to anyone): Don't forget that Springer was once mayor of Cincinnati

[Vick]

Originally posted by PornoDoggy+May 29 2004, 11:40 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (PornoDoggy @ May 29 2004, 11:40 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin--Vick@May 29 2004, 08:57 AM
Unions have outlived their necessity and have become a tool for those who don't want to put forth efforts and get paid for substandard work

Yes unions were needed in the last century, today they are an evil that holds back productivity and encourages workers not to perform to the best of their abilities.
Unions make it near impossible for an employer to reward employees on merit, productivity and ability
OMG ... pull the string, hear the dolly talk.

Your response is very little different than Kerry's. Kerry is reciting a set-piece from the playbook of the left; you are regurgitating the same old pablum usually spewed out by the right, who think everyone should be happy with Walmart wages.[/b][/quote]
I disagree - it's you who recites the playbook
Chapter and verse and wrap it in the guise of free thinking

PD - on a personal level you're a great guy and in addition ......

You are one of the smartest people I've ever run across
I've yet to ever see you be wrong (or at least admit it)

I did however see you concede a point about a good joke recently :)


You know I am in favor of earning as much as possible, but that's not possible within most union structures

Why should anyone allow a union to negotiate for them? I can handle my own salary negotiations just fine (should I ever be in that position again). I don't want to nor do I expect to earn what everyone else is earning. If I am able to contribute more to a company I should be compensated more. Unions don't allow that (at least for the most part- unless there are incentive bonuses)

Unions don't empower, they take away power from the individual

Beyond that I've seen first hand the way unions WASTE THEIR MEMBERS MONEY

Now stuff that in your pipe and smoke it (I've got a light for ya too) B)

[Winetalk.com]

PD,
do you like Kerry?

who has better ass,
Kerry or Carrie?

[TheEnforcer]

Originally posted by Vick@May 29 2004, 04:01 AM
p.s. Here's the source for you Joe

http://www.johnkerry.com/issues/

and something for devoted Democrats to think about
Jerry Springer is going to be a delegate at the Democratic National Convention
I can't figure out if he's looking for new guests or planning to catch up with some old guests


Edit for spelling
I'll take Springer as a delegate over any religious fundie the pubs bring to theirs any day of the week and twice on Sundays.
.

[PornoDoggy]

Originally posted by Vick@May 29 2004, 11:52 AM
I disagree - it's you who recites the playbook
Chapter and verse and wrap it in the guise of free thinking

PD - on a personal level you're a great guy and in addition ......

You are one of the smartest people I've ever run across
I've yet to ever see you be wrong (or at least admit it)

I did however see you concede a point about a good joke recently :)


You know I am in favor of earning as much as possible, but that's not possible within most union structures

Why should anyone allow a union to negotiate for them? I can handle my own salary negotiations just fine (should I ever be in that position again). I don't want to nor do I expect to earn what everyone else is earning. If I am able to contribute more to a company I should be compensated more. Unions don't allow that (at least for the most part- unless there are incentive bonuses)

Unions don't empower, they take away power from the individual

Beyond that I've seen first hand the way unions WASTE THEIR MEMBERS MONEY

Now stuff that in your pipe and smoke it (I've got a light for ya too) B)
I'm never afraid to admit when I'm wrong.

I'm sorry, Vick ... I guess I missed the news release announcing that the Chamber of Commerce has gone out of business. Unions will be rendered completely irrelevant when that happens, and not a day before.

That doesn't mean that I think the so-called unions of today are completely relevant to today's markets. I don't.

I'm not one of those idiots who thinks it is obscene for SWB, as an example, to report profits of 8 billion dollars. Far from it - I want SWB to make as much as they can. HOWEVER, I am from St. Louis, which used to be SWB's national HQ before they left for Texas; and they are still a large regional employer. I've worked for and with SWB in several capacities, and I know a lot of people who work and/or are retired from SWB, as well as having personal reasons for wanting to see their stock do as well as it can.

I do have a problem with a company making 8 billion dollars crying poormouth to its workers, and asking for concessions under the threat of taking jobs overseas. It fails what I consider to be the common sense test.

As far as why anyone should allow a union to negotiate for them ... it's pretty fucking simple. Ten people have a louder voice than one do, Vick. I am quite sure that unions waste their members' money (the inefficincies of scale). My father was technically a Teamster, after all (stayed in the union after going into sales and management only for the benefits). Still in all, I guaran-goddamn-t-you that MOST of the workers who have some of their money wasted also make a damn site more WITH that union than without.

[JoesHO]

Originally posted by Vick@May 29 2004, 05:57 AM
This is very scary

John Kerry strongly supports labor law reforms to assure that nurses have the right to organize. He believes that the card check and neutrality system is the most fair and equitable way for employees to establish their desire to form a union and for employers to recognize the union and begin negotiations. John Kerry worked closely with nurses in Brockton, Massachusetts to settle a strike and he understands that too often working conditions do not improve without the right to organize. John Kerry believes freedom of workers to form unions and bargain collectively is a fundamental right and he will not stand for a labor law system in which the union doors are shut for millions of workers.

Unions have outlived their necessity and have become a tool for those who don't want to put forth efforts and get paid for substandard work

Yes unions were needed in the last century, today they are an evil that holds back productivity and encourages workers not to perform to the best of their abilities.
Unions make it near impossible for an employer to reward employees on merit, productivity and ability
Sorry Vick, but I believe it is Greed that does this... not unions

Unions stand up for the little guy, enforce benifits for the working man.
( I agree with you that white collar people are hard workers too, but they have unions, and fellowship orginazations too)

unions, give cause for a negotiating point, without them. as was proven in the last century like you said earlier. That big coprorations have and will take advantage of humans in order to increase the bottom line for themselves. without unions there is no middle class! There are royalty, and then there are proletariat. One continuing to climb, and have the ability to bestow on their seed opportunity, that would not be afforded to the masses....

sorry but that will not, and does not work as a system, look at all the examples in history of this. :D

[JoesHO]

Originally posted by Mike AI@May 29 2004, 08:14 AM
One Joe left the debate, a new one joined!
I won't leave, it just might take me a little bit to get back.... but I am poised to convert you all yet, I still got 6 more months to bring you to your sences... :)

[Vick]

Herein lies the rub gentlemen

You concern yourselves with the good of the "common man" whereas I concern myself with my own good

In 2004 Unions are a waste, and downright evil. Unions take away the incentive to produce to the fullest capacity - neither of you deal with that issue

Simple human nature (of some) .....

If Joe, PD and I all work on the same assembly line and I can make 8 widgets an hour, PD can make 6 and Joe can make 10 - why do we all get the same payscale?
Where is the incentive to keep Joe producing 10 widgets when PD is getting paid more because he has been with the company longer and is actually producing less and costing more?

Now that is one of the the craziest things I've ever heard

The money (I've seen) wasted has less to do with inefficiencies of scale as it has to do with downright um ... pocket lining

I could go on about the evils of unions for hours ....

What about increased production by auto plants that were shut down and reopened as a non union shop (see East Lansing, Michigan)?

[Vick]

Why is Springer versus Roberson as delegates even mentioned?

They both stink

Why is it acceptable to choose one evil over the other?

In fact I didn't mention anything about the Republican National Convention, just the fact the Jerry Springer is a delegate to the Democratic National Convention