The Sporting Life...

[CuriousToyBoy]

Another board, another time, deserving of a run here:

Sports Illustrated Top 10 Sporting Money Earners for 2003

1 Tiger Woods Golf
Salary or winnings (including bonuses) $6,673,413
Endorsements and appearance fees $70,000,000
Total income $76,673,413

2 Shaquille O'Neal Los Angeles Lakers
Salary or winnings (including bonuses) $26,517,858
Endorsements and appearance fees $14,000,000
Total income $40,517,858

3 LeBron James Cleveland Cavaliers
Salary or winnings (including bonuses) $4,018,920
Endorsements and appearance fees $35,000,000
Total income $39,018,920

4 Peyton Manning Indianapolis Colts
Salary or winnings (including bonuses) $26,900,000
Endorsements and appearance fees $9,500,000
Total income $36,400,000

5 Kevin Garnett Minnesota T'wolves
Salary or winnings (including bonuses) $29,000,000
Endorsements and appearance fees $7,000,000
Total income $36,000,000

6 Oscar De La Hoya Boxing
Salary or winnings (including bonuses) $30,000,000
Endorsements and appearance fees $2,000,000
Total income $32,000,000

7 Andre Agassi Tennis
Salary or winnings (including bonuses) $2,530,929
Endorsements and appearance fees $24,500,000
Total income $27,030,929

8 Kobe Bryant Los Angeles Lakers
Salary or winnings (including bonuses) $13,498,000
Endorsements and appearance fees $12,000,000
Total income $25,498,000

9 Derek Jeter New York Yankees
Salary or winnings (including bonuses) $19,000,000
Endorsements and appearance fees $6,000,000
Total income $25,000,000

10 Grant Hill Orlando Magic
Salary or winnings (including bonuses) $13,279,250
Endorsements and appearance fees $11,000,000
Total income $24,279,250

What would Internet Porn's Top 10 Be?

[PBucksLauren]

Good post curious ;) That is a lot of fricking money!

[Mike AI]

Amazing numbers. Should have worked harder on my jumpshot, and tried to grow another 6 inches!

[Peaches]

When you consider how many PGA and USTA players barely make enough to survive, how many awesome basketball, baseball, and football players will never make it past college sports, etc., you realize how rare it is to make that kind of money in sports. :(

[Vick]

While I am all for earning as much as possible

the fact that Shaquille O'Neal makes $40,517,858 and schoolteachers are lucky to earn 50,000 a year is appalling

[PornoDoggy]

Originally posted by Vick@May 19 2004, 11:08 AM
While I am all for earning as much as possible

the fact that Shaquille O'Neal makes $40,517,858 and schoolteachers are lucky to earn 50,000 a year is appalling
Why is that appalling?

Is it more appalling than the fact that the CEO of Acme Widgets makes a multi-million dollar bonus for cost saving measures that unemploy the parents of your hypothetical teacher's students?

Guy worked his ass off against, as Peaches pointed out, some pretty daunting odds. Why is he any less deserving of a payoff at whatever the market will support than anyone else?

[SykkBoy]

I should have stuck with baseball...
My dad taught me to be ambidextrous and wanted me to become a switch pitcher. I had a great fastball righthanded and a wicked slider lefthanded by the age of 10, but I got so sick of the parents ruining the fun of little league that I stopped playing.

I was also a fairly good hitter from both sides of the plate (led Little League in hitting both years I played and led in ERA my second year). Of course in Little League, I could pitch one game and play 3rd base the next (I preferred 3rd base over pitching).

I guess all these years, I'll make a run at a softball league or something.....

[Vick]

Originally posted by PornoDoggy+May 19 2004, 11:35 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (PornoDoggy @ May 19 2004, 11:35 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin--Vick@May 19 2004, 11:08 AM
While I am all for earning as much as possible

the fact that Shaquille O'Neal makes $40,517,858 and schoolteachers are lucky to earn 50,000 a year is appalling
Why is that appalling?[/b][/quote]
You really have to ask? :D

[PornoDoggy]

So the free market is okay as long as the individual is doing something Vick considers worthy?

(P.S. - I put this in the same categtory as the arguement that it is "outrageous" that a CEO makes X times more than a factory worker.)

Now ... if we can just establish capital punishment for the folks who run check cashing places and Rent-A-Centers ...



Last edited by PornoDoggy at May 19 2004, 10:01 PM

[Vick]

PD - there is a huge difference in value there

a CEO is worth much more to the company in value and ability than a factory worker - not a good comparison

The value to anyone from O'Neil's efforts and a teachers efforts are worlds apart

Again that being said I'm all for earning as much as possible but looking at things on the scale of life, what contributes more, what is more important

Come on .......

[PornoDoggy]

Look, I think teachers, like cops, firefighters, and any number of others are underpaid.

But gimme a break, Vic ... Shaq makes what he makes because some damned fools are willing to pay it to him. One damned fool is willing to pay it to him because a whole bunch of other damned fools will lay out an average of $51.02 to see an NBA game, while other damned fools will pay him because even more damned fools are going to go buy sneakers or shirts or hats or cell phones or whatever the hell else Shaq is hawking.

And a great many of the damned fools who will go and see Shaq or buy whatever bucket of shit Shaq sells are the samed damned fools who will say how underpaid teachers, cops, firefighters, etc. are - right up until the time they go vote "No" on a pay increase for them.

[Buff]

Originally posted by PornoDoggy+May 19 2004, 10:35 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (PornoDoggy @ May 19 2004, 10:35 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin--Vick@May 19 2004, 11:08 AM
While I am all for earning as much as possible

the fact that Shaquille O'Neal makes $40,517,858 and schoolteachers are lucky to earn 50,000 a year is appalling
Why is that appalling?

Is it more appalling than the fact that the CEO of Acme Widgets makes a multi-million dollar bonus for cost saving measures that unemploy the parents of your hypothetical teacher's students?

Guy worked his ass off against, as Peaches pointed out, some pretty daunting odds. Why is he any less deserving of a payoff at whatever the market will support than anyone else?[/b][/quote]
Holy fucking shit! PD just validated markets over central planning!

Watch for reports of Hell freezing over.

[Buff]

Originally posted by PornoDoggy+May 19 2004, 10:35 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (PornoDoggy @ May 19 2004, 10:35 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin--Vick@May 19 2004, 11:08 AM
While I am all for earning as much as possible

the fact that Shaquille O'Neal makes $40,517,858 and schoolteachers are lucky to earn 50,000 a year is appalling
Why is that appalling?

Is it more appalling than the fact that the CEO of Acme Widgets makes a multi-million dollar bonus for cost saving measures that unemploy the parents of your hypothetical teacher's students?

Guy worked his ass off against, as Peaches pointed out, some pretty daunting odds. Why is he any less deserving of a payoff at whatever the market will support than anyone else?[/b][/quote]
Of course, it bears mentioning that education is NOT a free market, and that government schools have greatly distorted the markets for education such that salaries at the margin are not where they would be if the government couldn't support schools via taxation (as opposed to putting a competitive product out there).

[CuriousToyBoy]

Originally posted by Vick@May 20 2004, 02:08 AM
While I am all for earning as much as possible the fact that Shaquille O'Neal makes $40,517,858 and schoolteachers are lucky to earn 50,000 a year is appalling
Well don;t go to ANY games, stop watching sport on TV (including highlights on news shows), don't buy sneakers, don't wear the apparel.

I don't disagree that MANY jobs in our society are underapid, and badly. but it is the PUBLIC that dictate how much money these guys are worth.

They would be fools (or should get better managers) if they didn't milk it for EVERY dime they can get.

I don't begrudge them a cent.

I ALSO don't envy them for a second and would NEVER change places.

Not for 10 times Shaq's annual take.

:rokk:

[Buff]

Originally posted by Vick@May 19 2004, 09:09 PM
PD - there is a huge difference in value there

a CEO is worth much more to the company in value and ability than a factory worker - not a good comparison

The value to anyone from O'Neil's efforts and a teachers efforts are worlds apart

Again that being said I'm all for earning as much as possible but looking at things on the scale of life, what contributes more, what is more important

Come on .......
Hahaha

Vick, you're making interpersonal utility measurments. You have no idea what utility PD gets from watching Shaq or what utility an inner city child gets from his public "education."

[Buff]

Originally posted by PornoDoggy@May 19 2004, 11:24 PM
Look, I think teachers, like cops, firefighters, and any number of others are underpaid.

But gimme a break, Vic ... Shaq makes what he makes because some damned fools are willing to pay it to him. One damned fool is willing to pay it to him because a whole bunch of other damned fools will lay out an average of $51.02 to see an NBA game, while other damned fools will pay him because even more damned fools are going to go buy sneakers or shirts or hats or cell phones or whatever the hell else Shaq is hawking.

And a great many of the damned fools who will go and see Shaq or buy whatever bucket of shit Shaq sells are the samed damned fools who will say how underpaid teachers, cops, firefighters, etc. are - right up until the time they go vote "No" on a pay increase for them.
Another argument in favor of free markets....

Think of it like this: do you think there would ever be a need for a draft if the government offered competitive wages to soldiers? That is, suppose government offered to pay soldiers $150,000/year instead of $18,000/year. They could do away with the whole selective service nonsense -- the recruiting offices wouldn't be able to handle the traffic.

But since government has a monopoly on police and fire protection and national defense, and they can support those industries by coercive means (taxation), they can afford to pay lower salaries -- and there's a huge pool of undereducated and/or duty-driven citizens (mostly of the lower middle and lower classes) and usually failed by their public "schools" who view those jobs as better than any alternatives they have.

[PornoDoggy]

Originally posted by Buff@May 20 2004, 12:41 AM
Hahaha

Vick, you're making interpersonal utility measurments. You have no idea what utility PD gets from watching Shaq or what utility an inner city child gets from his public "education."
Yo, asswipe ... the last time I regularly went to NBA games was before the Hawks moved to Atlanta. I did see a couple of free games when the Clippers were playing in San Diego. The last time I watched one on television, Michael Jordan was a rookie.

But I'm curious ... I wonder if the inner city child derives the same utility from his poor quality education as you do from bragging about the quality of your private school education?

Or, a question more on point - do you derive the same pleasure from boasting about the quality of your private school education as Grogan used to derive from boasting of his alleged Mensa membership, or about his Camaro?

[Buff]

Originally posted by PornoDoggy+May 20 2004, 12:04 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (PornoDoggy @ May 20 2004, 12:04 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin--Buff@May 20 2004, 12:41 AM
Hahaha

Vick, you're making interpersonal utility measurments. You have no idea what utility PD gets from watching Shaq or what utility an inner city child gets from his public "education."
Yo, asswipe ... the last time I regularly went to NBA games was before the Hawks moved to Atlanta. I did see a couple of free games when the Clippers were playing in San Diego. The last time I watched one on television, Michael Jordan was a rookie.

But I'm curious ... I wonder if the inner city child derives the same utility from his poor quality education as you do from bragging about the quality of your private school education?

Or, a question more on point - do you derive the same pleasure from boasting about the quality of your private school education as Grogan used to derive from boasting of his alleged Mensa membership, or about his Camaro?[/b][/quote]
There's no way to measure and compare -- and that's one reason socialism always fails.

[Vick]

Ok, ok, ok you posters got me, you (mostly)are correct and making valid points

I know I'm comparing apples to oranges but still for me something there isn't working and the private enterprise to government funded enterprise comparison is solid

As for sports the only one I support is the NFL

PD - I don't have an answer to your question how many will pay 50 to watch Shaq play one game but vote no to pay raises for teaches (firefighters, police) but it does make a statement


WTF PD and I switched sides of the fence for this discussion?? :blink:

[PornoDoggy]

I haven't switched sides at all.

I am not now, nor have I ever been, an advocate of central planning, although I can understand why some simple minded people might have been taught to think so. I trust unregulated capital as much as I trust unregulated labor. No more, no less.