What is fair ?

[sarettah]

In business or personal life, what is fair? Is it a matter of "All's Fair" or are there limitations ?

What are the limits when it comes to trying to attain an advantage ?

Is the primary rule "never give a sucker an even break" and the proper price "whatever the market will bear"?

Is it ok to commit a crime in order to prove that someone else has committed one ?

Is it ok to look into any unlocked filing cabinet, underwear drawer, mailbox, trash bag, computer in order to "scout" your competitors, adversaries, enemies, Friends ??

The radio/chat thing with KM has had me thinking a bit. :unsure:

[Winetalk.com]

hmmmm....go to the Holy Bible for answers and I beleive
"eye for an eye" is a Biblical answer to the "moral dilemma"
;-))))

[Dravyk]

Depends ...

Here are some variables ... but not all of them ...

- case-by-case

- person-by-person

- whatever you can sleep with and live with

- never screw with members of 'The Family'

.... Is the Dark Side beckoning you, Sare?

[sarettah]

Originally posted by Dravyk@Apr 3 2004, 03:47 AM
.... Is the Dark Side beckoning you, Sare?
No....

The light side is beckoning... :yowsa:



(keep on hearing a little old lady that looks like a frog saying "go into the light, go into the light")

[Dravyk]

Originally posted by sarettah@Apr 3 2004, 09:07 AM
(keep on hearing a little old lady that looks like a frog saying "go into the light, go into the light")
And I keep hearing frogs going ... bud ... wise .... er. But I keep ignoring them. Stupid frogs don't know what good beer tastes like.

[theduderocks]

Originally posted by Dravyk+Apr 3 2004, 09:47 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Dravyk @ Apr 3 2004, 09:47 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin--sarettah@Apr 3 2004, 09:07 AM
(keep on hearing a little old lady that looks like a frog saying "go into the light, go into the light")
And I keep hearing frogs going ... bud ... wise .... er. But I keep ignoring them. Stupid frogs don't know what good beer tastes like.[/b][/quote]
There you go insulting the French again.

[Nickatilynx]

Ahhh....a moral dilemma.

Why not some input from one markedly lacking in them (alledgedly) ;-)))

I use alledgedly accurately because in this business there are many who believe me to be the biggest crook in Christendom and others who disagree.

For me , I work out what I think is fair for ME :)

I'm a shark.I make no bones about it.I do not run a charity and I'm not particularly bothered by what people ( who are not my friends or family) think of me.

I will make an arrangement to MY benefit and mine alone.

If you are actually thinking like that sarreatah , get the fuck out of this pond.

I won't fuck you cause you are a mate , but some of the other sharks round her are now begining to get feed frenzy over your post ;-)))

[gonzo]

Originally posted by Nickatilynx@Apr 3 2004, 01:15 PM
Ahhh....a moral dilemma.

Why not some input from one markedly lacking in them (alledgedly) ;-)))

I use alledgedly accurately because in this business there are many who believe me to be the biggest crook in Christendom and others who disagree.

For me , I work out what I think is fair for ME :)

I'm a shark.I make no bones about it.I do not run a charity and I'm not particularly bothered by what people ( who are not my friends or family) think of me.

I will make an arrangement to MY benefit and mine alone.

If you are actually thinking like that sarreatah , get the fuck out of this pond.

I won't fuck you cause you are a mate , but some of the other sharks round her are now begining to get feed frenzy over your post ;-)))
See even Nick has a code of honor.
The ones to be scared of are those the really dont have one.

Im not talking about the facade of one...Im talking real integrity that shows up when the chips are down. Some of you make fun of Southerners all you want I know several that I can count on when the chips are all the way down.

Not to say there arent any weasels down here either.
Points to ponder.
Do you think its honorable to:

1. Fuck your friends as soon as their back is turned?
2. Not pay your debts because you really dont know the person?
3. Steal someones idea and cut him out as the middleman as repayment after hes shown you how to make a nice living and given you his contact as a matter of trust?


The Easy money is gone.
Those who do not change will see only change in their bank account.
This is the only industry that accepts out and out theft as a given because the other party is a "good guy" or bought em drinks/dinners and sent em nice Christmas gifts.

A lot of people say that Nick and Serge are 2 of the most evil people in this business. I say I know exactly where they both stand and I know better than to pull my pants down in front of em...grease up my asshole and dare em to fuck me.

[theduderocks]

Originally posted by gonzo+Apr 3 2004, 10:57 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (gonzo @ Apr 3 2004, 10:57 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin--Nickatilynx@Apr 3 2004, 01:15 PM
Ahhh....a moral dilemma.

Why not some input from one markedly lacking in them (alledgedly) ;-)))

I use alledgedly accurately because in this business there are many who believe me to be the biggest crook in Christendom and others who disagree.

For me , I work out what I think is fair for ME :)

I'm a shark.I make no bones about it.I do not run a charity and I'm not particularly bothered by what people ( who are not my friends or family) think of me.

I will make an arrangement to MY benefit and mine alone.

If you are actually thinking like that sarreatah , get the fuck out of this pond.

I won't fuck you cause you are a mate , but some of the other sharks round her are now begining to get feed frenzy over your post ;-)))
See even Nick has a code of honor.
The ones to be scared of are those the really dont have one.

Im not talking about the facade of one...Im talking real integrity that shows up when the chips are down. Some of you make fun of Southerners all you want I know several that I can count on when the chips are all the way down.

Not to say there arent any weasels down here either.
Points to ponder.
Do you think its honorable to:

1. Fuck your friends as soon as their back is turned?
2. Not pay your debts because you really dont know the person?
3. Steal someones idea and cut him out as the middleman as repayment after hes shown you how to make a nice living and given you his contact as a matter of trust?


The Easy money is gone.
Those who do not change will see only change in their bank account.
This is the only industry that accepts out and out theft as a given because the other party is a "good guy" or bought em drinks/dinners and sent em nice Christmas gifts.

A lot of people say that Nick and Serge are 2 of the most evil people in this business. I say I know exactly where they both stand and I know better than to pull my pants down in front of em...grease up my asshole and dare em to fuck me.[/b][/quote]
Great post G. WTF ever happened to honour and honesty?

[sarettah]

Originally posted by Nickatilynx@Apr 3 2004, 01:15 PM
If you are actually thinking like that sarreatah , get the fuck out of this pond.

I won't fuck you cause you are a mate , but some of the other sharks round her are now begining to get feed frenzy over your post ;-)))
lolololol.....

hell, no meat to chew on here.

I do business my way and probably will continue to. I have not fucked anyone over (that I am aware of) and I try not to let myself be fucked over.

I generally go by the rule that you are not ripped off unless you feel ripped off (which is why I do not look at computer prices until at least 6 months after I have bought a new one)

Good post Nick, you too Gonzo :)

[Peaches]

OK, since Gonzo made a thinly veiled reference to it, I will ask a question which sparked a bit of a disagreement a few weeks ago :awinky:

Let's say, for example you own a business and someone steals a large amount of money from you. The business is currently worth $100K and you owe $400K to your creditors which includes friends and strangers - all business dealings, not personal. You only owe $100K of that to your friends. Do you pay your friends 100% what you owe them or do you pay everyone 25 cents on the dollar? Would you pay your friends the $100K and then sell your house, your car, your stocks, etc. in order to pay the other creditors? Or do you pay your friends and let the other businesses realize that sometimes the cost of doing business is to have a loss?

I said I would pay the $100K to my friends and close up shop. I know when my ex-husband ran up tens of thousands of dollars in credit card bills and I was required to pay them (funny how that works - if both your names are on the card, the one they can find is the one who pays - screw what your divorce decree says) I filed bankruptcy against those bills only. I paid anything I owed BEFORE I filed. We would have had to live in complete poverty to pay those bills and quite frankly, I wasn't willing to do that to cover something I had no control over. I don't think I did the dishonorable thing. Gonzo thinks differently. B)

Discuss :)

[gonzo]

Peaches you really dont want to get me stirred up on this again. Because I will name names. You owe a debt you pay a debt....friend,foe,fuck buddy it dont matter.

How the bill got rung up is your problem not mine. And you know my ass is real tender to the tune of $250K over the course of 2 years on this subject too!

I dont want to hear excuses -- I want my money. I had to pay for the goods and the employees to deliver service. No such thing as debt insurance that I know of...and if there is. Please contact me. I want some.

You know this is gonna end up bad being discussed.

[theduderocks]

Originally posted by Peaches@Apr 3 2004, 04:59 PM
OK, since Gonzo made a thinly veiled reference to it, I will ask a question which sparked a bit of a disagreement a few weeks ago :awinky:

Let's say, for example you own a business and someone steals a large amount of money from you. The business is currently worth $100K and you owe $400K to your creditors which includes friends and strangers - all business dealings, not personal. You only owe $100K of that to your friends. Do you pay your friends 100% what you owe them or do you pay everyone 25 cents on the dollar? Would you pay your friends the $100K and then sell your house, your car, your stocks, etc. in order to pay the other creditors? Or do you pay your friends and let the other businesses realize that sometimes the cost of doing business is to have a loss?

I said I would pay the $100K to my friends and close up shop. I know when my ex-husband ran up tens of thousands of dollars in credit card bills and I was required to pay them (funny how that works - if both your names are on the card, the one they can find is the one who pays - screw what your divorce decree says) I filed bankruptcy against those bills only. I paid anything I owed BEFORE I filed. We would have had to live in complete poverty to pay those bills and quite frankly, I wasn't willing to do that to cover something I had no control over. I don't think I did the dishonorable thing. Gonzo thinks differently. B)

Discuss :)
So you fucked up. After all this bullshit you have posted about me, you are a deadbeat?
"I don't want to think about today, I'll think about it tomorrow."
Southern belle....lmfao

[Peaches]

Originally posted by gonzo@Apr 3 2004, 09:05 PM
Peaches you really dont want to get me stirred up on this again. Because I will name names. You owe a debt you pay a debt....friend,foe,fuck buddy it dont matter.

How the bill got rung up is your problem not mine. And you know my ass is real tender to the tune of $250 over the course of 2 years on this subject too!

I dont want to hear excuses -- I want my money. I had to pay for the goods and the employees to deliver service. No such thing as debt insurance that I know of...and if there is. Please contact me. I want some.

You know this is gonna end up bad being discussed.
I asked a non-name question and even used my own situation as an example. :awinky:

The title is "What is fair" and based on your post, I gave an example of a situation where you would have to make the best of it. :okthumb:

[theduderocks]

Originally posted by Peaches+Apr 3 2004, 05:13 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Peaches @ Apr 3 2004, 05:13 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin--gonzo@Apr 3 2004, 09:05 PM
Peaches you really dont want to get me stirred up on this again. Because I will name names. You owe a debt you pay a debt....friend,foe,fuck buddy it dont matter.

How the bill got rung up is your problem not mine. And you know my ass is real tender to the tune of $250 over the course of 2 years on this subject too!

I dont want to hear excuses -- I want my money. I had to pay for the goods and the employees to deliver service. No such thing as debt insurance that I know of...and if there is. Please contact me. I want some.

You know this is gonna end up bad being discussed.
I asked a non-name question and even used my own situation as an example. :awinky:

The title is "What is fair" and based on your post, I gave an example of a situation where you would have to make the best of it. :okthumb:[/b][/quote]
Your so freekin broke you cant pay 250? I paid that for dinner last night. And after all the grief you gave me. :P

[sarettah]

Unfortunately, we live in a country that tends to encourage bankruptcy etc.

Back a few years ago, I had my credit way overextended, making late payments, all that. I went to buy a house for about double my salary and could not get the credit for it (although I could go buy a fairly expensive car at that time in two hours time..go figger). Anyway, I worked extremely hard at learning some financial discipline, paid off every cent plus interest and late charges.

Took a hell of a lot longer to clear from my credit record than a bankruptcy would have. I had many financial and legal types that said I would have been better off with a bankruptcy rather than working through it.

So, while my paying it all off somehow might make me feel superior morally, it really did not help me financially.

[gonzo]

Originally posted by Peaches+Apr 3 2004, 08:13 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Peaches @ Apr 3 2004, 08:13 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin--gonzo@Apr 3 2004, 09:05 PM
Peaches you really dont want to get me stirred up on this again. Because I will name names. You owe a debt you pay a debt....friend,foe,fuck buddy it dont matter.

How the bill got rung up is your problem not mine. And you know my ass is real tender to the tune of $250 over the course of 2 years on this subject too!

I dont want to hear excuses -- I want my money. I had to pay for the goods and the employees to deliver service. No such thing as debt insurance that I know of...and if there is. Please contact me. I want some.

You know this is gonna end up bad being discussed.
I asked a non-name question and even used my own situation as an example. :awinky:

The title is "What is fair" and based on your post, I gave an example of a situation where you would have to make the best of it. :okthumb:[/b][/quote]
Your in the no spin zone and I shouldnt have to tell you that.
If your want to listen to people suck each others dick and slap each other on the back and tell them they are the coolest and its ok ...theres this show on Wednesdays that prides itself on that....

oh Ybother...?

[sarettah]

Originally posted by theduderocks@Apr 3 2004, 08:16 PM
I paid that for dinner last night. And after all the grief you gave me. :P
There are lots of really good decent poor folk in the world.

Probably just as many fucked up evil rich people.

Money may be a measure of success in business (although not a great one because many of the rich and famous are there by birthright or found money rather than of their own volition) but it is hardly a measure of success in life.

[theduderocks]

Its not to do with being rich or poor. Its about paying your way and paying your debts. This is a woman that shit all over me and cannot even pay off 250. Its a credibility issue. She would rather buy flowers than pay Gonzo what she owes. That sucks. Or do you think its ok to do that?

[Peaches]

Originally posted by sarettah@Apr 3 2004, 09:16 PM
Unfortunately, we live in a country that tends to encourage bankruptcy etc.

Back a few years ago, I had my credit way overextended, making late payments, all that. I went to buy a house for about double my salary and could not get the credit for it (although I could go buy a fairly expensive car at that time in two hours time..go figger). Anyway, I worked extremely hard at learning some financial discipline, paid off every cent plus interest and late charges.

Took a hell of a lot longer to clear from my credit record than a bankruptcy would have. I had many financial and legal types that said I would have been better off with a bankruptcy rather than working through it.

So, while my paying it all off somehow might make me feel superior morally, it really did not help me financially.
Paying your own debts is one thing. I've lost money through the years through bad decisions, and I've eaten mac-n-cheese and hotdogs in order to get it paid back. I've never not paid any of my debts and when I borrowed money from my Dad, he got 100% interest.

But paying someone else's debts (especially when that someone owed/owes me additional tens of thousands of dollars I'll never see) just wasn't something I planned on doing. :angry: IIRC, I was going to be left with $125 a week to live on and support a child with once the credit cards garnisheed my wages. :unsure:

This was back in the mid 80's - before a lot of the laws regarding collections were passed. The harrassment from these companies was just intolerable. After the guy from AMX told me he was going to make sure my kid was taken from me because I couldn't pay my bills, I called a BR attorney and never looked back :)

[gonzo]

Originally posted by theduderocks@Apr 3 2004, 08:24 PM
Its not to do with being rich or poor. Its about paying your way and paying your debts. This is a woman that shit all over me and cannot even pay off 250. Its a credibility issue. She would rather buy flowers than pay Gonzo what she owes. That sucks. Or do you think its ok to do that?
I agree with you 100%!!!

But just to clarify...Peaches doesnt owe me $250 bucks. She owes me dinner at Commanders Palace but that aint no big deal. We got sidetracked in Vegas.

It amazes me how people in this indsutry condone out and out theft. I cant wait to watch Deadwood again Sunday night. They shoot horse theives on there. And when times get tight....Al seZ "First drink is on me and pussy is half off for the next 15 minutes!"

[Peaches]

Originally posted by theduderocks@Apr 3 2004, 09:24 PM
Its not to do with being rich or poor. Its about paying your way and paying your debts. This is a woman that shit all over me and cannot even pay off 250. Its a credibility issue. She would rather buy flowers than pay Gonzo what she owes. That sucks. Or do you think its ok to do that?
What ARE you talking about? :unsure:

[Peaches]

I owe Gonzo $250? This is news to me. :zoinks:

[theduderocks]

you always pay debts to colleagues. you can renague on banks and insurance companies, but never colleagues.
I will never treat you with the same grudging respect again. You fucked up big time. Please never again respond to my posts with such venom. You have sunk yourself.

[sarettah]

Originally posted by theduderocks@Apr 3 2004, 08:24 PM
Its not to do with being rich or poor. Its about paying your way and paying your debts. This is a woman that shit all over me and cannot even pay off 250. Its a credibility issue. She would rather buy flowers than pay Gonzo what she owes. That sucks. Or do you think its ok to do that?
I don't know the story behind the $250, so I do not have a real strong opinion on it. I don't know how/if Gonzo got screwed and I don't know what role Peaches played in it so.

I was raised with the idea and I fully agree with it that if you incur a debt you pay it.

But I have also dealt with friends and family enough that if I lend someone money, I write it off the books right there and then. That way I don't walk around pissed off at friends and instead, on those times that I do get paid back, it is a pleasant surprise.

My standard for my own behaviour is way higher than the standard I expect from the rest of the world most of the time.

[sarettah]

Originally posted by gonzo@Apr 3 2004, 08:05 PM
Peaches you really dont want to get me stirred up on this again. Because I will name names. You owe a debt you pay a debt....friend,foe,fuck buddy it dont matter.

How the bill got rung up is your problem not mine. And you know my ass is real tender to the tune of $250 over the course of 2 years on this subject too!

This is where the very confusing $250 comes in...

[theduderocks]

A deadbeat is a deadbeat is a deadbeat.....She is painting her house and buying flowers when she ows a colleague of hers and ours, money. Is this right?

[Peaches]

J'Retardedude - how stupid can you possibly be? This isn't about me, you moron, lol! :lol: :lol: :lol:

And Sare, I agree - I never lend money to friends and family. If they need it, I give it to them. "Loans" between family and friends usually end poorly. :(

[gonzo]

Originally posted by sarettah+Apr 3 2004, 08:34 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (sarettah @ Apr 3 2004, 08:34 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin--gonzo@Apr 3 2004, 08:05 PM
Peaches you really dont want to get me stirred up on this again. Because I will name names. You owe a debt you pay a debt....friend,foe,fuck buddy it dont matter.

How the bill got rung up is your problem not mine. And you know my ass is real tender to the tune of $250 over the course of 2 years on this subject too!

This is where the very confusing $250 comes in...[/b][/quote]
Only a pussy would whine about $250 bucks ...I forgot to put the K at the end.

[sarettah]

Originally posted by Peaches@Apr 3 2004, 08:35 PM
J'Retardedude - how stupid can you possibly be? This isn't about me, you moron

Throw me in the retard club because I had the distinct picture from Gonzo's reply to you that somehow he was still pissed at you over $250 owed somewhere in the past..... :unsure:

[theduderocks]

Originally posted by Peaches@Apr 3 2004, 05:35 PM
J'Retardedude - how stupid can you possibly be? This isn't about me, you moron, lol! :lol: :lol: :lol:

And Sare, I agree - I never lend money to friends and family. If they need it, I give it to them. "Loans" between family and friends usually end poorly. :(
OK, I misread that. It happens. You can safely now go back to trashing me. Sorry.

[Peaches]

Originally posted by sarettah+Apr 3 2004, 09:34 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (sarettah @ Apr 3 2004, 09:34 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin--gonzo@Apr 3 2004, 08:05 PM
Peaches you really dont want to get me stirred up on this again. Because I will name names. You owe a debt you pay a debt....friend,foe,fuck buddy it dont matter.

How the bill got rung up is your problem not mine. And you know my ass is real tender to the tune of $250 over the course of 2 years on this subject too!

This is where the very confusing $250 comes in...[/b][/quote]
Sare, it's NOT me, hehehe. It's someone else but it's a conversation Gonzo and I had (and still have, hehehe) where we disagreed about things :okthumb: Heck, after years of watching things explode, do you really think I'd be dumb enough to owe ANYONE who posts on the boards $$$? :lol:

[sarettah]

Originally posted by gonzo@Apr 3 2004, 08:38 PM
Only a pussy would whine about $250 bucks ...I forgot to put the K at the end.
So it is $250,000 ?? dayum..... Who owes who what where when... I apparently missed something somewhere......

[gonzo]

Originally posted by sarettah+Apr 3 2004, 08:38 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (sarettah @ Apr 3 2004, 08:38 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin--Peaches@Apr 3 2004, 08:35 PM
J'Retardedude - how stupid can you possibly be? This isn't about me, you moron

Throw me in the retard club because I had the distinct picture from Gonzo's reply to you that somehow he was still pissed at you over $250 owed somewhere in the past..... :unsure:[/b][/quote]
Yall aint gonna let me go buy no ice wine are you?

No this is a discussion that has spilled outta ICQ. We wont go into the deadbeats that comprise that debt. Its tax time and my ass is still sore.

[Peaches]

Originally posted by sarettah+Apr 3 2004, 09:38 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (sarettah @ Apr 3 2004, 09:38 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin--Peaches@Apr 3 2004, 08:35 PM
J'Retardedude - how stupid can you possibly be? This isn't about me, you moron

Throw me in the retard club because I had the distinct picture from Gonzo's reply to you that somehow he was still pissed at you over $250 owed somewhere in the past..... :unsure:[/b][/quote]
Well, truth be known, Confucy was right - I DO pay for sex AND Gonzo and I are having an affair....he charges me and I'm in arrears....so to speak. :nyanya:

[sarettah]

Gotcha... so apparently this is referring to a conversation between you and Gonzo about someone who did a bankruptcy and got out of $250K owed....

And apparently Gonzo or a company or group he was affiliated with was left owed the $250K...

Am I close ?

:yowsa:

[sarettah]

Originally posted by gonzo@Apr 3 2004, 08:40 PM
Yall aint gonna let me go buy no ice wine are you?

Alcohols bad....hmmmkay

[Peaches]

Originally posted by sarettah@Apr 3 2004, 09:41 PM
Gotcha... so apparently this is referring to a conversation between you and Gonzo about someone who did a bankruptcy and got out of $250K owed....

And apparently Gonzo or a company or group he was affiliated with was left owed the $250K...

Am I close ?

:yowsa:
The jury is still out on if the bankruptcy is a 7 or 11, so all debts COULD still be paid. But you're close enough :awinky:

Now I have to go work the streets to get that $250 so I can "pay da man"! :grrr:

[Hell Puppy]

Here's my take. First off, if you give preferential treatment to your friends just before filing bankruptcy, some very interesting things can happen in bankruptcy court. Your friends that you try to save may in fact get dragged in deeper if you're not careful.

Getting in debt to friends isn't generally conducive to retaining that friendship.

Ok, so who do I pay first? My pecking order is based on what I personally think is fair and my own sense of right and wrong. First people I pay are employees. They have families that depend on that paycheck. I pay them in full even if I do have to hock something.

I divide up whatever is left with the vendors who have unsecured credit lines with me. They are out goods and services. I return what I can and pay what I can.

Last on my list is secured creditors, banks, etc. Why? They knew they were taking a risk and were compensated for that risk in the form of interest and points. And besides that, the line gets inverted as soon as it hits bankruptcy court with secured creditors being first in line to get their piece of the corpse.

[Vick]

Originally posted by Peaches@Apr 3 2004, 08:41 PM
DO pay for sex AND Gonzo and I are having an affair....he charges me and I'm in arrears....so to speak. :nyanya:
Peaches is in Gonzo's arrears,........


.......... I didn't know Gonzo had more that one rear

and it's a sexual thing he he he



I couldn't resist and just wanted to post arrears :yowsa:

[Carrie]

Hrmm. "ThatDudesAnIdiot" would've been a better name, methinks.

Peaches, you did what was right - it was his debt, not yours, and that debt collector should have been fired on the spot.