Why don't most old school adult people?

[GrimShawn]

Like the newer crowd. Not saying the total noob's who are clueless, but newer ones who have been around a few years. Like anyone who has been around from 99 and on seem to not be accepted by the old school people.

Is it that they are afraid of change, or maybe it's ego, or just the respect your elders deal.

I am unsure what it is, I can't totally pin point it. I could honestly care less, but I do find it funny how most of them come across.

There are some smart people out there that may not have the stripes that older crowd has, but they have the desire to get ahead. I have found with some of the old school people they have fallen into a routine and gotten sloppy which makes it easier to make money off them. I don't mind, I am just curious as to what brings this ego/aura on.

:bjump:

[Mike AI]

I think this is an over exageration. There are some people who have come in since 1999 that I think have done well, and are credits to the industry.

But most are fuckups.... of course I am the type of guy who does not cockholsters, and there are none bigger, and more numerous then in the old school crowd.

It is generally accepted a certain % of all groups are going to be cockholsters. Ask Colin, he can probably give you specific numbers and explainations on why.

:D

[Winetalk.com]

read my signature

[Almighty Colin]

Old-timers form an in-group, just like TGP webmasters do, or Oprano poster, or GFY poster. Even notice when someone new comes to the board
and attacks a long-time poster how everyone defends the long-time poster? Even people who are traditionally on opposite sides of every debate will defend each other against a newcomer. We ain't nothin' but mammals.

[TeenGodFather]

I'm loved by everyone. I feel so special! :nyanya:

[Almighty Colin]

The opposite is true too. A lot of "newer" webmasters have formed an anti-old-timer bias and think of them as set in their ways and unable to innovate. We've all seen such comments on the boards. It's a typical attack newbies try on Serge at GFY for example.

[Almighty Colin]

Originally posted by TeenGodFather@Mar 3 2004, 06:24 AM
I'm loved by everyone. I feel so special! :nyanya:
It's true. You are "special"!

[GrimShawn]

Originally posted by Colin@Mar 3 2004, 03:26 AM
The opposite is true too. A lot of "newer" webmasters have formed an anti-old-timer bias and think of them as set in their ways and unable to innovate. We've all seen such comments on the boards. It's a typical attack newbies try on Serge at GFY for example.
GFY is a bad expample for this. I was more basing it on people who make money in the industry, not hope to pay there bills based on selling there sig.

GFY also has this vybe that you get ahead by being an outcast. If you are a smart ass of can piss with someone big there then you are a somebody, but at the end of the day if your most profitable thing each month is what TCG pays you for your sig then you are by far not someone who I consider "Industry"

[Almighty Colin]

Originally posted by GrimShawn@Mar 3 2004, 06:52 AM
GFY is a bad expample for this. I was more basing it on people who make money in the industry, not hope to pay there bills based on selling there sig.

GFY also has this vybe that you get ahead by being an outcast. If you are a smart ass of can piss with someone big there then you are a somebody, but at the end of the day if your most profitable thing each month is what TCG pays you for your sig then you are by far not someone who I consider "Industry"
GFY is a perfect example of in-group, out-group bias in action.

[fyrflygrl]

Originally posted by GrimShawn@Mar 2 2004, 11:00 PM
Like the newer crowd. Not saying the total noob's who are clueless, but newer ones who have been around a few years. Like anyone who has been around from 99 and on seem to not be accepted by the old school people.

Is it that they are afraid of change, or maybe it's ego, or just the respect your elders deal.

I am unsure what it is, I can't totally pin point it. I could honestly care less, but I do find it funny how most of them come across.

There are some smart people out there that may not have the stripes that older crowd has, but they have the desire to get ahead. I have found with some of the old school people they have fallen into a routine and gotten sloppy which makes it easier to make money off them. I don't mind, I am just curious as to what brings this ego/aura on.

:bjump:
Hiya GrimShawn :)

You've brought up an issue that interests me greatly. I've often wondered at this myself, and here's my li'l ole two cents:

The industry is experiencing palpable change...I can feel it, can't you? If the change is for the better or worse will depend on the shoes you're standing in...

Personally, I think the industry is honing itself... Chances are, some of these guys have been around since early to mid nineties probably started out on a home pc and throwing up a page with any old thing and making money... There's NOTHING wrong with that, but those days are over.

I think that some of the guys that have been in the industry for a long time can REALLY feel it in these areas:

1) what in the hell are so many women doing in the business? :angry:
2) whose that young punk on MY red carpet?? That's MY special treatment! :wnw:
3) What in the hell is 2257 and all the other legal shiznit that I now have to add to my site? :zoinks:
4) What in the hell are all these other porn sites doing out there?? :(

What do you think?

[Almighty Colin]

Originally posted by fyrflygrl@Mar 3 2004, 08:47 AM
1) what in the hell are so many women doing in the business? :angry:
2) whose that young punk on MY red carpet?? That's MY special treatment! :wnw:
3) What in the hell is 2257 and all the other legal shiznit that I now have to add to my site? :zoinks:
4) What in the hell are all these other porn sites doing out there?? :(

What do you think?
I think most of these issues were cleared 5 years ago, not today.

There was a wave of "legalization" in 1996 or so that was much greater than anything going on today. Scanned pics, stolen content, and so forth.
Much of the issue was then that newcomers would have to be educated as to what was legal, more than the other way around. Newbie chatboards popped up under this assumption.

"All these other porn sites"? Again, that was a real issue about 1998-1999. Been there, done that. The explosion started a long time ago.

Women in the business? I haven't noticed a disproportionate change. There were plenty of great, smart women in the business back "in the day" and there still are today. Angry? I don't know a single person who even considers it an issue. Maybe you do.

Not sure about the red carpet. Not many punks on red carpets.



Last edited by Colin at Mar 3 2004, 09:24 AM

[fyrflygrl]

Originally posted by Colin+Mar 3 2004, 06:02 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Colin @ Mar 3 2004, 06:02 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin--fyrflygrl@Mar 3 2004, 08:47 AM
1) what in the hell are so many women doing in the business? :angry:
2) whose that young punk on MY red carpet?? That's MY special treatment! :wnw:
3) What in the hell is 2257 and all the other legal shiznit that I now have to add to my site? :zoinks:
4) What in the hell are all these other porn sites doing out there?? :(

What do you think?
I think most of these issues were cleared 5 years ago, not today.

There was a wave of "legalization" in 1996 or so that was much greater than anything going on today. Scanned pics, stolen content, and so forth.
Much of the issue was then that newcomers would have to be educated as to what was legal, more than the other way around. Newbie chatboards popped up under this assumption.

"All these other porn sites"? Again, that was a real issue about 1998-1999. Been there, done that. The explosion started a long time ago.

Women in the business? I haven't noticed a disproportionate change. There were plenty of great, smart women in the business back "in the day" and there still are today. Angry? I don't know a single person who even considers it an issue. Maybe you do.

Not sure about the red carpet. Not many punks on red carpets.[/b][/quote]
The industry is constantly in a state of flux... Growth tends to do that....

1) I love it that there are so many women in the adult industry, but I've seen it piss some old schoolers dead off... try asking some of the old school tgp owners to add a 'porn for women' category.... organizations like womeninadult.com are developing... along with new female webmaster boards...

2) Maybe you're right.. but I've seen some successful adult webmasters that look, well, like puppies ;) Webmasters are competitive and egotistical about their successful sites.... and there's a lot more of them. Rather than expect the red carpet, I think some of the old schoolers will eventually vie for the red carpet, and already see new webmasters as contenders.

3) The very nature of adult will never let related legal issues die. There will always be some sort of legality issue. Then it was content, now it's age and cp...

4) Re: new sites.. I haven't seen this slow down or stop, have you?

So the birth of newbie boards was geared around teaching legal issues? That's a cool little factoid.

Fyrflygrl

[Winetalk.com]

fyrflygrl, very keen observation, indeed.....

[Almighty Colin]

Originally posted by fyrflygrl@Mar 3 2004, 10:09 AM
The industry is constantly in a state of flux... Growth tends to do that....

1) I love it that there are so many women in the adult industry, but I've seen it piss some old schoolers dead off... try asking some of the old school tgp owners to add a 'porn for women' category.... organizations like womeninadult.com are developing... along with new female webmaster boards...

2) Maybe you're right.. but I've seen some successful adult webmasters that look, well, like puppies ;) Webmasters are competitive and egotistical about their successful sites.... and there's a lot more of them. Rather than expect the red carpet, I think some of the old schoolers will eventually vie for the red carpet, and already see new webmasters as contenders.

3) The very nature of adult will never let related legal issues die. There will always be some sort of legality issue. Then it was content, now it's age and cp...

4) Re: new sites.. I haven't seen this slow down or stop, have you?

So the birth of newbie boards was geared around teaching legal issues? That's a cool little factoid.

Fyrflygrl
We have two completely different reference frames here. To real old timers, TGPs themselves are still new :-)

I agree that legalization issues will always be around. I don't see that they've effected "old-timers" anymore than newer webmasters though.

Webmasters savvy enough to have survived and/or *gasp* prospered since the 1995 era aren't asking "what in the hell are all these other porn sites doing out there?" As matter of fact, such discussions as the coming influx of new porn webmasters and predictions of porn going more mainstream were regular on the boards from 1996-1998. I don't think many peoople were caught offguard. These discussions were held on the board for many years. It has always been my contention that the number of porn sites would increasing faster than the number of porn buyers and that this would contribute to falling signup ratios in time.

[taboo_gal]

Our fyrflygrl certainly poses great thinking questions. :)

My take on what MAY (I stress may) piss old schoolers off about newbies

1) Some coming in have huge attitudes. They immediately diss before being dissed to try and make a place for themselves. This behaviour can be found in any schoolyard bully.

2) A good number of newbies think this is a get rich quick biz and little or no work is involved.

3) Perhaps they view all the increased fraud and newly imposed Visa Regs are the fault of those fly by nite newbs.

I've personally not felt any angst from biz vets. Maybe I've not exhibited the attitudes others have or thought or pretended I knew it all. But, I find them to be wealths of information and am grateful for what they can teach me. I may not always like how the message comes across, but I learn nonetheless. :)

Change is always inevitable. Some good, some bad, but it is all what you make of it...newbie or vet.

[AM Jeff]

I been around a while and I'm not sure what group I fit in..lol
But then again, I help everyone.

But, I guess, I am old school.
I use alot of our old tricks on surfers, but use them on webmasters alike.

Who knows.

[Toolz]

Where is this red carpet you speak of?

Not sure where you get that feeling from, I have however noticed that over the last couple of years there are more women in "power" positions in companies, hell our President is a woman and has been for 3-4 years but I see more and more women running companies and doing very well.

You seem to think there's an old "boys" network going on, when it may simply be the fact that lots of us have been around and partying with each other for so long we like to keep hanging with each other as it's a comfortable environment for us.

[Winetalk.com]

Originally posted by taboo_gal@Mar 3 2004, 10:52 AM


Change is always inevitable. Some good, some bad, but it is all what you make of it...newbie or vet.
yeap, NONE is immune from failures, old and newbs alike.

[Winetalk.com]

Originally posted by Toolz@Mar 3 2004, 10:59 AM
hell our President is a woman and has been for 3-4 years but I see more and more women running companies and doing very well.


tell that to Caroline Tilga....
;-)))

[fyrflygrl]

One thing that is a *certainty* about 'old school' webmasters vs. new shcool.....

There are probably thousands of webmasters that would have long since fallen on their bums without old school webmasters to show them the right and wrong ways to do business.... I don't think the industry would be nearly so satisfying if some of the things hadn't come to pass (newbie boards for example)...

I have a deep respect for longevity in this industry... especially the guys and gals that have been around since the early to mid nineties... when an Internet year is about 4-6 months long, that's a hella long time to maintain a business successfully.



Last edited by fyrflygrl at Mar 3 2004, 08:15 AM

[taboo_gal]

On women in the industry, they've always been there and not just in front of the camera. The difference, I think, between then and now is we're becoming more comfortable with our involvement and stepping out of the shadows. There will always be those with sexist viewpoints, but I don't feel they are the majority; at least not anymore.

[*KK*]

Men, women, sheep, monkeys...

who really cares as long as the work gets done and the money gets banked...

[Mike AI]

Originally posted by *KK*@Mar 3 2004, 12:06 PM
Men, women, sheep, monkeys...

who really cares as long as the work gets done and the money gets banked...


Still have that CCBill work ethos eh?

:lol: :lol:

Just kidding, I could use some trained monkeys over here!! We have lots of work going on !!

[Winetalk.com]

Originally posted by *KK*@Mar 3 2004, 12:06 PM
Men, women, sheep, monkeys...

who really cares as long as the work gets done and the money gets banked...
KK, nowadays even banking is a problem...
FDIC only insures $100,000 per bank
;-)))

[*KK*]

Originally posted by Mike AI+Mar 3 2004, 09:11 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Mike AI @ Mar 3 2004, 09:11 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin--*KK*@Mar 3 2004, 12:06 PM
Men, women, sheep, monkeys...

who really cares as long as the work gets done and the money gets banked...


Still have that CCBill work ethos eh?

:lol: :lol:

Just kidding, I could use some trained monkeys over here!! We have lots of work going on !![/b][/quote]
ROFL it was my icq with you right about the time I made the post that put it in my mind ;)

Just remember there's a bank on nearly every corner Serge <_<

[Winetalk.com]

Originally posted by *KK*+Mar 3 2004, 12:39 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (*KK* @ Mar 3 2004, 12:39 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>Originally posted by -Mike AI@Mar 3 2004, 09:11 AM
<!--QuoteBegin--*KK*@Mar 3 2004, 12:06 PM
Men, women, sheep, monkeys...

who really cares as long as the work gets done and the money gets banked...


Still have that CCBill work ethos eh?

:lol: :lol:

Just kidding, I could use some trained monkeys over here!! We have lots of work going on !!
ROFL it was my icq with you right about the time I made the post that put it in my mind ;)

Just remember there's a bank on nearly every corner Serge <_<[/b][/quote]
KK, you are mistaken...not all banks are created equal, as far as interst they pay...
one day you know what I mean
;_)))

[Peaches]

Originally posted by Serge_Oprano@Mar 3 2004, 01:14 PM
KK, nowadays even banking is a problem...
FDIC only insures $100,000 per bank
;-)))
I don't have a use for this currently, but I bookmarked it in hopes for future reference :awinky:

http://www.cdars.com/

[*KK*]

Serge, with interest rates so low, the bank isnt really the best idea now is it? Especially not with 'interest' being much better in other places ;)

[Winetalk.com]

Originally posted by *KK*@Mar 3 2004, 01:17 PM
Serge, with interest rates so low, the bank isnt really the best idea now is it? Especially not with 'interest' being much better in other places ;)
KK, I'll take 2% FDIC insured in today's environment
http://ingdirect.com

call me names,
but I like:
1) to be liquid
2) sleep like a baby at nite
;-)

[gonzo]

Originally posted by fyrflygrl+Mar 3 2004, 08:47 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (fyrflygrl @ Mar 3 2004, 08:47 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin--GrimShawn@Mar 2 2004, 11:00 PM
Like the newer crowd. Not saying the total noob's who are clueless, but newer ones who have been around a few years. Like anyone who has been around from 99 and on seem to not be accepted by the old school people.

Is it that they are afraid of change, or maybe it's ego, or just the respect your elders deal.

I am unsure what it is, I can't totally pin point it. I could honestly care less, but I do find it funny how most of them come across.

There are some smart people out there that may not have the stripes that older crowd has, but they have the desire to get ahead. I have found with some of the old school people they have fallen into a routine and gotten sloppy which makes it easier to make money off them. I don't mind, I am just curious as to what brings this ego/aura on.

:bjump:
Hiya GrimShawn :)

You've brought up an issue that interests me greatly. I've often wondered at this myself, and here's my li'l ole two cents:

The industry is experiencing palpable change...I can feel it, can't you? If the change is for the better or worse will depend on the shoes you're standing in...

Personally, I think the industry is honing itself... Chances are, some of these guys have been around since early to mid nineties probably started out on a home pc and throwing up a page with any old thing and making money... There's NOTHING wrong with that, but those days are over.

I think that some of the guys that have been in the industry for a long time can REALLY feel it in these areas:

1) what in the hell are so many women doing in the business? :angry:
2) whose that young punk on MY red carpet?? That's MY special treatment! :wnw:
3) What in the hell is 2257 and all the other legal shiznit that I now have to add to my site? :zoinks:
4) What in the hell are all these other porn sites doing out there?? :(

What do you think?[/b][/quote]
The industry is in the middle of flushing all the shit down the commode.
And just like shit in a toilet you will have some that hang on and even way after will leave a stain that you have to bleach out.

Your right some of us were making cash on this when it was on our home PC's. There wasnt an internet...you were coming into my house on my box.

Keep in mind its those very people that pushed the boundaries of what "was" to what "is"!

I think your right too that a lot of stuff was just thrown up and cashed out. But there also were those that were targetting ads to their traffic as opposed to heeding popular advice of throwing up anything as an ad because people will buy it. Id hate to spend the next month trying to pull up some of my old Central Ad stats just to validate my point.

From where I sit...
1. Women have always been in this industry. Women are this industry! Its only proper that they do more things than just be on camera.

2. Whats a red carpet? Maybe its a little more accurate to say...whats this young punk doing pissing on the carpet!

3. 2257 is the other shoe to be dropped in conjunction with Visa. Thanks Traci Lords!

4. Other porn sites are out there for me to upsell or trade traffic with.

What I think is that youve confused the 'old school' innovators of online with folks that had watched the news in Atlanta too much heralding the Players Ball and Pimps and Hos.

While there are a few people that are members of both groups ...I dont think you can generalize based on age or "time served'.

[Amberlita]

I'm old school, new school, middle school...a woman...not content...and been doing business with old schoolers (male, female and Serge's alike) since 1995 - I've also always worked with new schoolers because many have given me ideas of new directions to go, and have also taught me new tricks along the way.

I've always said, and still do today, that as soon as you think you know it all in this industry, you may as well close up shop. The ONLY thing that is consistent in this business, is change! And if you don't adapt and grow...well, it was nice knowing ya.

And that's my 2 pennies on the subj. ;-)

[Winetalk.com]

Originally posted by Amberlita@Mar 3 2004, 04:26 PM
...and been doing business with old schoolers (male, female and Serge's alike) since 1995 -
not correct...
your site went live selling CD's in...1996, NOT 1995,
check archives.org
;-)
if I remembered your domain, I'd post it myself
;-)))

[Mike AI]

If there was some kind of block with old school doing business with new school and looking down on them, this could be a reason

http://www.oprano.com/msgboard/index.php?a...2fdedcc980c4cd4 (http://www.oprano.com/msgboard/index.php?act=ST&f=1&t=9887&s=076df7cea4f522adc2fdedcc980c4cd4)

[Amberlita]

Originally posted by Serge_Oprano+Mar 3 2004, 01:33 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Serge_Oprano @ Mar 3 2004, 01:33 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin--Amberlita@Mar 3 2004, 04:26 PM
...and been doing business with old schoolers (male, female and Serge's alike) since 1995 -
not correct...
your site went live selling CD's in...1996, NOT 1995,
check archives.org
;-)
if I remembered your domain, I'd post it myself
;-)))[/b][/quote]
LOL Serge! Actually, the site went live in Dec. of 95...you and I hooked up in Jan. of 96. :-)

Are you still bucking for that $10 - or did your winnings at the blackjack table cover that. ;-))

[Winetalk.com]

Originally posted by Amberlita+Mar 3 2004, 04:43 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Amberlita @ Mar 3 2004, 04:43 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>Originally posted by -Serge_Oprano@Mar 3 2004, 01:33 PM
<!--QuoteBegin--Amberlita@Mar 3 2004, 04:26 PM
...and been doing business with old schoolers (male, female and Serge's alike) since 1995 -
not correct...
your site went live selling CD's in...1996, NOT 1995,
check archives.org
;-)
if I remembered your domain, I'd post it myself
;-)))
LOL Serge! Actually, the site went live in Dec. of 95...you and I hooked up in Jan. of 96. :-)

Are you still bucking for that $10 - or did your winnings at the blackjack table cover that. ;-))[/b][/quote]
Amber, black jack table erased all debts, public and private
;-))

as for Jan 1996...nope.
we meet in COTAC days and COTAC wasn't around 'till May 1996
(domain registered in June)

I don't rememebr what I had for breakfast, but I remember what happened long ago VERY well
;-)))

[Amberlita]

Damn...you DO have a good memory!

Rett and I got our first site (selling CD's and Video's) up in Dec. of '95 on a local host's server...within a month, we had chomped up all of their bandwidth and they cut us off....Jan. of 96 was when we got with a real hosting company that could handle the bandwidth. Ahhh..the good 'ol days when the problems were that you had too much traffic. ;-))

[Winetalk.com]

Originally posted by Amberlita@Mar 3 2004, 04:58 PM
Damn...you DO have a good memory!

Rett and I got our first site (selling CD's and Video's) up in Dec. of '95 on a local host's server...within a month, we had chomped up all of their bandwidth and they cut us off....Jan. of 96 was when we got with a real hosting company that could handle the bandwidth. Ahhh..the good 'ol days when the problems were that you had too much traffic. ;-))
hahahah,
yeap, I'd take this problem NOW any time
;-)))

[masterp74]

I've been in this industry for 8 months and I'm accepted by old school. They better or else :matey:

[Snoops]

Originally posted by Colin@Mar 3 2004, 06:02 AM

Women in the business? I haven't noticed a disproportionate change. There were plenty of great, smart women in the business back "in the day" and there still are today. Angry? I don't know a single person who even considers it an issue. Maybe you do.


I TOTALLY agree Colin - in 7 years I've had ONE idiot say something negative about being a woman in this biz - and that was within 2 weeks of me starting out.

Fyrflygrl - I think the new boards for and about female webmasters are more a 'sign of the times' as far as needing to 'niche out' resources to maximize profits as they are anything else.

We are in midst of the micro-niching phenomenon - tgp boards, graphics boards, newbie boards, women boards, hell, there's so many different kinds I don't think anyone could list them all.

However, the first 'female webmaster' get together was a long, long time ago. I believe it was in Montreal of '99 and then we had another one in Miami '99. So the boards really aren't anything new....just kind of an online manifestation of what we've been doing anyway for years :o)

[gonzo]

Originally posted by Mike AI@Mar 3 2004, 04:36 PM
If there was some kind of block with old school doing business with new school and looking down on them, this could be a reason

http://www.oprano.com/msgboard/index.php?a...2fdedcc980c4cd4 (http://www.oprano.com/msgboard/index.php?act=ST&f=1&t=9887&s=076df7cea4f522adc2fdedcc980c4cd4)
Summer is around the corner Mike....youngsters wont be smokin cigarettes and watching Captain Kangaroo.....

Then you tell me what will pimpdawg do?